Arsenal Thread

Abou wouldn't that come full circle though, If Barcelona decide Thiago can go then theirs a gem for everyone to try and take but I wouldn't be surprised he'd be back on Barcelona's radar in 5 years time.
 
Yep Full circle :LOL: I think its disrespectful that Barca use 3rd party(whatnots) or players to say We want you then turn to the media and say last year they should of taken our proposal. Now, he not worth that much (they have every right) Cesc head is turn and now he not sure Barca wants him. So, he force to say to the media I thing Barca is the best Club and my dream to go back......- crawling on hands n knees innit.


My disrespectful radar might be a little different for most. I come from families from the high sea and No mountain regions force on a raft to a land w/ no friends or family .:LOL:

You want someone come through the front door not the back or side ....simples!
 
Aboutreika18 said:
If I was Wenger, I'd make sure I'd get Thiago Alcântara as part of any Fabregas deal.

It could be argued that Arsenal would be getting the better end of the deal if that ever happened.
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Somehow he reminds me of Romario's calm/cold/very confident playing style.
 
It's quite simple, really. As Bobby mentioned a non-world class player like Henderson or Phil Jones going for 20million pounds means we should see no less than 40million pounds for Cesc. It sounds fair to me.
 
tc811 said:
It's quite simple, really. As Bobby mentioned a non-world class player like Henderson or Phil Jones going for 20million pounds means we should see no less than 40million pounds for Cesc. It sounds fair to me.
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The problem precisely is paying those ammounts for players like henderson or jones. It's nuts spending that. Maybe is just that the english market has gone crazy and spends more than the others. Here, for example, roma is going to pay 10 millions for bojan. That's the dimension of trades by now.

Last year we spent 40 millions euros on villa, and that's what we should spend, maximum, for cesc, that is on a similar level than villa. Barcelona is offering about 35 millions euros as an initial number, which is reasonable to get to 40 at the end. Plus, there would be additional clauses and payments depending on performance.

By no means cesc is over 40 millions euros in my oppinion, and it's not disrespect, just different views and different markets.
 
BobbyBox said:
Arsenal are being dicks signing your young players, but that is a different story. (although I still think Barcelona should look at why these young players want to leave one of the best youth set ups, playing for the best team in the world, to come and play for Arsenal? there is something else there that might need to be looked at?)
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the reason why it happens is because in spain you can't do contracts to young players, until they have 17, i think. Arsenal comes to la masia and offers a lot of money and theres nothing you can do to retain them. They get 2 or 3 players each season by this method. Those who go away know they will win plenty of money and if they dont evolve enough, at least they made some money. The ones that stay are those who believe in la masia as a football school and think they can make it to the first team. Others dont think they can make it, and then money speaks volumes.

So there's little barcelona can do to avoid this practices by english clubs, who are allowed to offer contracts to those boys.

So, i'm with beboq here, i like people to come by the front door, not the back one...
 
drekkard said:
The problem precisely is paying those ammounts for players like henderson or jones. It's nuts spending that. Maybe is just that the english market has gone crazy and spends more than the others. Here, for example, roma is going to pay 10 millions for bojan. That's the dimension of trades by now.

Last year we spent 40 millions euros on villa, and that's what we should spend, maximum, for cesc, that is on a similar level than villa. Barcelona is offering about 35 millions euros as an initial number, which is reasonable to get to 40 at the end. Plus, there would be additional clauses and payments depending on performance.

By no means cesc is over 40 millions euros in my oppinion, and it's not disrespect, just different views and different markets.
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The disrespect part was how your president was speaking about Fab. They can offer what they want for him that's not disrespectful, but trying to say that a 24 year old player is worth less than the year before is just insulting everybodies intelligence and is not respectful to Fabregas.

drekkard said:
the reason why it happens is because in spain you can't do contracts to young players, until they have 17, i think. Arsenal comes to la masia and offers a lot of money and theres nothing you can do to retain them. They get 2 or 3 players each season by this method. Those who go away know they will win plenty of money and if they dont evolve enough, at least they made some money. The ones that stay are those who believe in la masia as a football school and think they can make it to the first team. Others dont think they can make it, and then money speaks volumes.

So there's little barcelona can do to avoid this practices by english clubs, who are allowed to offer contracts to those boys.

So, i'm with beboq here, i like people to come by the front door, not the back one...
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Would you want players that are just after the money to stay at your club? you might be better off without them. it is a way to sift out the players that are only seeking the money.

Our youth team must be brimming with ex Barca youth players if we are getting 2 or 3 a season?

If the players were in Barca's future plans, then there would be ways around it. Barcelona could reassure them of what contract they might get when they reach 17 etc i'm sure they would rather stay there than come to Arsenal?

I'm not saying it is that easy, but there has to be something more to it, than Arsenal come along with lots of money and they all skip along merrily to London?

are they coming through the 'back door'? what is the difference if they come through the 'front door' but you use shitty tactics to get them? doesn't make it any better in my book.

Anyway Barca and Arsenal are both dicks, just in different ways :DD
 
BobbyBox said:
Would you want players that are just after the money to stay at your club? you might be better off without them. it is a way to sift out the players that are only seeking the money.
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That is the crucial part, the difference between English fans and all other fans around the world. All the players do it for the money... "we" realize that and don't mind.
 
gerd said:
That is the crucial part, the difference between English fans and all other fans around the world. All the players do it for the money... "we" realize that and don't mind.
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It sounds like Drekkard minds?
 
I agree with both drekkard n bobby both make good arguments. It`s even harder to ignore what one does right w/o pointing out their wrong. The value is tricky Fab is Arsenal`s best player even though he been injured ,but we know once he`s fully fit he will be back to his best.


Barca knows Fab is special ,Pep wants him and feels he is xavi`s best replacement in 3 years time Fab`s value will either increase or decrease. I bet it will increase ! Whatever happens fans need to understand it`s business not personal.Get the best value at a smaller price. Does Arsenal even owe any clubs at the moment? I know whatever business we do w/ Barca it may take 5 years before we get paid :LOL:

Also, I heard Arsenal is selling 2,500 unit flats near the Emirates. Arsenal seem to like real-estate .... very interesting generating funds and adding jobs. Arsenal Home Projects
 
BobbyBox said:
It sounds like Drekkard minds?
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I'm sorry Bobby, but i really don't understand what you were saying (i mean literally, that must be the first time that my English is not good enough...strange.).
Would you care to elaborate on that?

Thanks.

Edit: i see now. You were saying that drekkard does mind that football players are only in it for the money? Well i also do up to a certain degree, but i have the feeling that "we" (the continentals) don't mind as much as English fans do.

Football is more and more about money and i do care about that. But we have the feeling that you single out the players. It's not the players who are to blame: it's the different FA's, FIFA and UEFA.

One example.

Negotiations for the new television money just ended here in Belgium. To general disbelief the 16 clubs will receive an astonishing 55 million euro's. That is amouint that has to be divided among 16 clubs. Man Utd alone has 65 million pounds...that says it all. I don't blame Man Utd at all. And people will say that luch more people will want to watch United matches than matches between HO Leuven and Sint-Truiden. I agree. I agree partly because due to the television money English clubs can attract players that no Belgian club can buy.

Our Man Utd is Anderlecht. There are rumours abound now about a big transfer that Anderlecht will do with the money the will get from Lukaku (if he is transferred). The "big name" is an Arsenal players: Vela. Most English fans will see this as the definite proof that Vela did not succeed (and i agree). That is a good evidence about the unfair competition in football. I don't blame clubs or players...it's the system. Free market economy is not a good idead in sports, it has to be regulated free market economy like in the USA.

Rant over, and i'm sorry.
 
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gerd said:
I'm sorry Bobby, but i really don't understand what you were saying (i mean literally, that must be the first time that my English is not good enough...strange.).
Would you care to elaborate on that?

Thanks.

Edit: i see now. You were saying that drekkard does mind that football players are only in it for the money? Well i also do up to a certain degree, but i have the feeling that "we" (the continentals) don't mind as much as English fans do.

Football is more and more about money and i do care about that. But we have the feeling that you single out the players. It's not the players who are to blame: it's the different FA's, FIFA and UEFA.

One example.

Negotiations for the new television money just ended here in Belgium. To general disbelief the 16 clubs will receive an astonishing 55 million euro's. That is amouint that has to be divided among 16 clubs. Man Utd alone has 65 million pounds...that says it all. I don't blame Man Utd at all. And people will say that luch more people will want to watch United matches than matches between HO Leuven and Sint-Truiden. I agree. I agree partly because due to the television money English clubs can attract players that no Belgian club can buy.

Our Man Utd is Anderlecht. There are rumours abound now about a big transfer that Anderlecht will do with the money the will get from Lukaku (if he is transferred). The "big name" is an Arsenal players: Vela. Most English fans will see this as the definite proof that Vela did not succeed (and i agree). That is a good evidence about the unfair competition in football. I don't blame clubs or players...it's the system. Free market economy is not a good idead in sports, it has to be regulated free market economy like in the USA.

Rant over, and i'm sorry.
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No need to apologise. The money in Football, especially in the Premier League is ridiculous.

I think British fans get aggrevated at the way players act in order to chase more money. usually the ones that are after the money have certain characteristics and do not treat the situation with inteligence or respect for the fans that pay to see them and chant their name and probably earn on average a quarter of what the footballer earns in a week, they earn in a year....that is why fans get angry.

If a player wants to move fine, if you want to get a raise fine, but there are ways to go about it, which alot of players seem to dismiss.
 
I do agree with you. The first one that comes to mind is Ashley Cole, i lost all my respect for him the way he moved from Arsenal to Chelsea.
It will sound paternalistic and old fashioned but IMO these young players should get more guidance from the clubs. Anderlecht is doing this after Van Den Borre. Van Den Borre became a first team regular at the age of 16 and was not the brightest kid in town (and that is an understatement). The day he became 18 he bought himself the most expensive Mercedes. He totalled it the same day and bought a second one...this says it all.
 
BobbyBox said:
No need to apologise. The money in Football, especially in the Premier League is ridiculous.

I think British fans get aggrevated at the way players act in order to chase more money. usually the ones that are after the money have certain characteristics and do not treat the situation with inteligence or respect for the fans that pay to see them and chant their name and probably earn on average a quarter of what the footballer earns in a week, they earn in a year....that is why fans get angry.

If a player wants to move fine, if you want to get a raise fine, but there are ways to go about it, which alot of players seem to dismiss.
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And i think all fans feel like this bobby. I agree with every word of it. I too would prefer salary caps, more limitations and more noble players in our teams, both in the pitch and in the offices.

The same annoyment arsenal fans have with barcelona because of fabregas, and surely with a reason, it's the same kind of annoyment barcelona fans feel in the other side everytime a youngster goes away because of money the club cant offer. It's all about money and that's why think players should cost less. If there was a transfer cap, and many clubs could have big players and it wasnt strictly the money that ruled who gets big.

Probably all of us have a romantic football lover inside.
 
I hope one day we have a strict salary cap, salaries that are very similar to real job ones. Something in the range of min. £500 to max. £3000-4000 per week. And I hope Football goes back to being about Football only.

I just can't believe there is so much money spent on all these ignorant brats when there are so many people in need. I still don't get why one would need £10,000 a week, let alone 10 and 20 times that. I understand anyone would want that much, yes. Its all for unnecessary luxuries. Maybe only a very, very small fraction would seek that much money for humanitarian reasons, but we know the vast majority of football players these days are all about greed. I hate it. And like Bobby said, the least these knuckle-heads can do is respect the people who support them and give their hard earned cash to watch them week in week out.

We all talk about the millions in transfers every transfer window like we're talking about 1000's. That's disturbing.

There's so much wrong in this world but who gives a flying flock.

Rant over.
 
That is no rant Lami. I hope most people feel the same.
The other side of the medal would be that we would see much less football. Why are the wages inflated? Because since roughly 20 years, football is much in demand. Until the end of the 80's football used to be (in England) the pass time of the working man. Since the beginning of the 90's (Gazza's tears!) it has become an occupation for middle and higher class people, hence the inflated wages and ticket prizes...
 
I wished this could happen, but we can't go back in time. This is all very poetic. It's utopia. Now football is sitting at the top of the entertainment pyramid, people are ready to pay loads of money to go to the stadium and watch the superstars in action. More than a sport, it has become entertainment, and when you have an overwhelming demand for it, the figures increase ridiculously.

If the fans had enough of the prices, stopped going to the stadium and no longer got Sky Sports at home, then maybe we would see the sport side of football prevailing again. But we all know it's utopia.

If European football, particularly English, was to adhere to the American sports models, with franchises and salary caps, it could drive investors away and it would be a very chaotic transition. Would Abramovich be happy to abide by that?

Getting back to our topic, the Cesc saga: Barcelona don't seem happy to pay 40M, they have their reasons, they use their weapons and newspaper antics, but it doesn't change the way the market functions. Gerd mentioned the Andy Carroll deal. It was 37M pounds. This kind of thing inflates the market ridiculously. English football has gone crazy with figures indeed, but blame Liverpool, blame City, blame Abramovich. Don't blame Arsenal. If they see a dubious striker being sold for that kind of figure, they will gauge the Fabregas deal as a 50M one. And, we're sorry if in Spain things don't work like that, but this is business and a club won't make distinctions to where the player is being sold to. Hell, we got 25M for bloody Adebayor, there's no way I can see Fab leaving for less than 40M.

The wear and tear comments made by Rossell, well... I won't even give my two cents on that.
 
Barcelona is happy paying the 40 mil on Sanchez, who turns 23 in a few months. BUT, in return they'd have to sacrifice Villa, offering him to either City or Chelsea for 40 mil.
 
As long as I know, barcelona is going to pay around 25 million Euros for Sanchez. Too much, also, in my oppinion. And Villa won't go anywhere.

If Alexis is worth 25, though, then Cesc should be around 35-40 million Euros. I consider both signings too expensive anyway.
 
That article is great, as are all goal.com articles.

The premise appears to be that they need to sell Villa to pay for Sanchez, Fabregas and Rossi. So they need to raise the £40m to afford the £91m outlay.

Clever folk over there at goal.com with a great grasp of both reality and finance ;)
 
:LOL:

I think what I understood from reading different articles, that Barca have about 40 mil to spend, plus the 40 mil from Villa, would total 80 mil. Not bad to try and get all 3 with that.

I think they mixed up pounds with Euros. 80 mil pounds = about 91 mil Euros.
 
Hey maybee a straight swap Fabregas<->Villa... not happening!
And anyway why do they mant to get rid of Villa he is world class player and he has been in Barcelona only one season!
I think these reports are false!
 
Aboutreika18 said:
So paying the same amount for Sanchez as you did for Chygrynskiy is too much?
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Exactly, is paying too much for both of them, an absolute nonsense in my oppinion.

Barcelona won't sell Villa. Probably Rossi is not coming and only Alexis and another player (maybe Cesc, maybe not, it's in Arsenal hands). Barcelona has 45 M€ to spend, and add to that the money the club gets for players like Bojan, Jeffren, Maxwell (if sold), Milito (if any), Jonathan soriano and other boys form la masia that are going away this summer. And add the latest installments for Ibra from Milan (all big clubs always pay late, that's so bloody true).

So, theorically, Barcelona could buy Alexis and Cesc without getting rid of Villa. And if Thiago goes to Arsenal, it's even easier (and you would have the winning end of the swap, but that's my personal oppinion).
 
drekkard said:
Exactly, is paying too much for both of them, an absolute nonsense in my oppinion.

Barcelona won't sell Villa. Probably Rossi is not coming and only Alexis and another player (maybe Cesc, maybe not, it's in Arsenal hands). Barcelona has 45 M€ to spend, and add to that the money the club gets for players like Bojan, Jeffren, Maxwell (if sold), Milito (if any), Jonathan soriano and other boys form la masia that are going away this summer. And add the latest installments for Ibra from Milan (all big clubs always pay late, that's so bloody true).

So, theorically, Barcelona could buy Alexis and Cesc without getting rid of Villa. And if Thiago goes to Arsenal, it's even easier (and you would have the winning end of the swap, but that's my personal oppinion).
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my opinion is....

1st Cesc situation seems to be in Barca`s court to be frank.
2nd Thiago will be great but NO Thanks! it will be merry -go-round Cesc part II .
3rd I know you support Arsenal after Barca ,but you must see Cecs is more of a want then a need.Hence why you feel his value is low .
 
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