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SPAIN thread

they're playing 4-6-0 that's Bold! and actually pretty smart that way they'll dominate the midfield and put on a huge pressure on the Italians.
I think Barça played with the formation against Santos didn't they?
 
Scotland bluprinted the 4-6-0 formation.

Craig Levein should be knighted!:WORSHIP:
 
Anyone else dreading the 4-6-0 formation? I found Spain pretty dull in the World Cup - all hard fought 1-0 victories - and that was with David Villa up front.

Today it's gonna be pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass foul pass pass pass pass pass etc for 90 minutes, until they cave - send Pique up front and start actually creating some havoc ;)
 
And again we are reminded of the difference between Villa and Torres today. :(

Two great chances, both squandered. Credit to Buffon who TOTALLY knew what he was gonna do. The predictable kick to the outside to outrun/dribble keeper. He anticipated that perfectly and stopped him.

You can bet your ass, David Villa would've scored at least ONE of those two great chances but probably both.

And Soldado and Llorente would've buried one as well.
 
Fabulous match, two fantastic goals. I doubt we'll see a better match in this tournament.
Both teams were very good.
Credit to Italy who played offensive and good football. Torres and Balotelli bot missed chances.
 
The bad thing about that 2nd one (The chip) is that if he had just squared the ball to Navas, he would've had OPEN net! Because Buffon and the defender who was previously marking Navas in that counter-attack got drawn to Torres and put pressure on him. So a simple pass to Navas and he's got a straight shot to goal but he went the selfish way. And while nobody minds when you're being selfish IF you score, when you don't, it really does come back to bite you in the ass. Navas could've gotten the winner for Spain but Torres elected to go for it himself (as if to redeem the previous missed chance) and he missed.
 
What happened to Llorente?
I cant't believe the world champions play with no strikers with a stupid 4-6-0 formation and expects to score goals. The only menacing moments came when Fabregas, Iniesta and Silva combined with their quality. But overall, Spain lacks that extra edge - unsurprisingly, cause any team would with a formation like that.

It's too much possession, too many passes and not enough objective play and aggression. In the first half Italy had much less possession but had more scoring chances. Having a natural CF makes all the difference and I hope Del Bosque changes this.
If they insist in this game of passing to death, they will get punished in the knockout stages.
 
Kaiser said:
Scotland bluprinted the 4-6-0 formation.

Craig Levein should be knighted!:WORSHIP:
Click to expand...
After 2 years we discovered Del Bosque appreciated his tactic!

4-6-01.jpg
 
A striker was needed obviously today in spain for,ation. Bloody obvious. But it was a fantastic match and I loved things of both teams. Di natale must be a starter, as well as Llorente and Probably Pedro.

spain will miss villa a lot.
 
I was fuming at Torres.... What more could you ask for to lift your name. Spain proves to me that their blue print can be reprinted with another. Italy were very good and Im surprise how they played I know they have more surprises .
 
What happened to Soldado. He isn't even in the squad, did he have a bad end of season or is he injured...he seemed the man to replace Villa for me.

Alex: i don't see where Pedro would fit in for Spain... Surely you can't prefer him to Silva?
 
Having xavi, iniesta silva and cesc in the same formation is just too much pass. Spain suffers a terrible lack of wingers and pedro is just that, a great winger that now, after being injured most of the season, is in form. Spain needs at least one winger and a striker to convert all that midfield goodness into chances.

Besides, pedro is amazingly good at off the ball movement and pressuring, things that navas completely lack. He may not have a big name, but he scores in important matches and opens the field.

So personally I would take out one of the great midfielders and put a winger like pedro or navas and take out one of the 2 DMF to put a striker. Risky, but thats how barcelona plays and how most of the team is used to play. I like offensive strategies, I really do.
 
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I have a bad feeling on Chelsea if Torres is the striker. He is completely clueless and fighting confidence. An easy chance wasted.
 
The few times i watched Navas with Spain, i really liked him.
But to be fair i seem to remember a WC match where Pedro was very good.
 
I think Pedro would've caused us many problems yesterday. Jesus Navas seems to be a good player, but imo he didn't add anything to the team. Pedro creates space, sort of like what Robinho does at Milan.
 
Mehtab said:
I have a bad feeling on Chelsea if Torres is the striker. He is completely clueless and fighting confidence. An easy chance wasted.
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For christ sake, let me point out few things to you:

- He didn't dictate the transfer fee and a price doesn't make somebody superhuman.

- He played 15-20 minutes yesterday, like he has in many matches this year, I can't understand how you can put a result down to a striker failing to convert 3 half chances in 15 minutes when for 70 minutes the rest of the team failed.

- People talk like 4 years ago he was scoring every chance he had, He wasn't, the difference is 4 years ago his confidence was higher, the teams he played for had faith in him and therefore played to his strengths, He was playing a lot more and therefore getting more chances.

- For me club and country missed a trick, his goal vs Barca was what I think the point where he regained his confidence, you saw that in the follow up QPR game. Then he was left out of the two most important games of his club career so far and to top that, not only do his country leave him out of their first game, but they choose to do so with no strikers, effectively saying they would rather play a negative system, than give one of the Worlds top strikers, who you would think after his re-assurances at Chelsea would have a HUGE hunger to prove himself, an opportunity to get himself back on the map.
 
Cassandra said:
For christ sake, let me point out few things to you:

- He didn't dictate the transfer fee and a price doesn't make somebody superhuman.

- He played 15-20 minutes yesterday, like he has in many matches this year, I can't understand how you can put a result down to a striker failing to convert 3 half chances in 15 minutes when for 70 minutes the rest of the team failed.

- People talk like 4 years ago he was scoring every chance he had, He wasn't, the difference is 4 years ago his confidence was higher, the teams he played for had faith in him and therefore played to his strengths, He was playing a lot more and therefore getting more chances.

- For me club and country missed a trick, his goal vs Barca was what I think the point where he regained his confidence, you saw that in the follow up QPR game. Then he was left out of the two most important games of his club career so far and to top that, not only do his country leave him out of their first game, but they choose to do so with no strikers, effectively saying they would rather play a negative system, than give one of the Worlds top strikers, who you would think after his re-assurances at Chelsea would have a HUGE hunger to prove himself, an opportunity to get himself back on the map.
Click to expand...

If he lacks confidence why does he want's to play? Every striker's goal is to score. It doesn't matter what he was before, the only thing matters is what he is now.

P.S. I think you are a Torres fan.
 
i think del bosque watched our game vs russia and realised how easily russian midfielders were able to penetrate through our defensive line with simple one-twos. that's probably the logic behind his "no striker" setup.
besides we were lining up quite an experimental defensive line: it was the first time prandelli tried the 3 men setup, our central defender was actually a midfielder, chiellini was coming from an injury and there was no wingback on the left..... so del bosque probably wanted to take advantage of this messy situation by not giving our defenders any benchmark at all; it's much easier for the defenders to read an offense when u line up a striker and the assignements for the defenders are much more obvious, so he probably wanted to make de rossi feel as unconfortable as possible.
when u think about it, it makes perfect sense.

the thing is, apparently during this past week we were able to sort out our concentration issues and the defensive line was holding up pretty well. it was evident, after half an hour that this strategy wasn't working. so del bosque should have probably put the striker in sooner.
then again, ideally u wanna wait as much as possible to make your substitutions, to take advantage of the stamina gap between those who were on the pitch from the beginning and those who come after.... so i kinda understant del bosque's reluctancy to make this move sooner.

infact, when u think about it, the timing of his substitutions was actually spot on. torres came in fresh and full of energy, when our entire team was completely worn out. he had 2 clear chances in less than 10 minutes, and that was precisely because, at that point in the game, the azzurri were too tired to mantain a balanced structure any longer (FFS, we almost took 2 goals from counters!! an italian team suffering from counter attacks... that kinda says it all! :LOL: ).
let's be honest, had torres passed that ball to jesus navas, spain would have scored and right now we would all be praising del bosque for his well timed decisions.

one thing is for sure though. like abou already said, spain is just too narrow with this setup. i understand it's hard to leave a player like david silva on the bench, but there's just no room for him and u desperately need jesus navas to provide u with some width and spread the opposite defensive lines.
i think navas should have been a starter yesterday.

anyway it was a great game. it took an extremely focused italy to hold up against u lot, and even that was almost not enough, as by the end of the game we were completely exhausted (had the game lasted 5 more minutes, spain would have probably scored).

also i absolutely loved the fair play from both sides. it was a very intense game, but the adrenaline never got the better of the players and there were some very nice moments between the italians and the spanish :BEER:
 
Good post Ben.
I agree with what you say about Navas, but i would leave out another player than Silva. His assist yesterday was absolutely brilliant. And with Man City he was absolutely stunning for months. In the end he got tired because he had to play too much. Now he's rested a few weeks and he showed once again what a fantastic player he was.

Edit: i would leave out both Fabregas and Iniesta for Navas and a striker. I know that Iniesta played a great match and was named MOTM, but IMO Silva is more decisive (although i don't necessarily rate him higher than Iniesta, they are both fantastic). Spain misses Villa immensely!

As with Torres, i kind of agree with Cassandra, although i not a Torres fan. I think it would be better for both Chelsea and Torres if he left Chelsea and went playing for another good club (i'm thinking about a loan to Spurs for some reason). It's purely a matter of confidence, it can't be possible that he lost all his abilities. The last years only Eto'o was a better striker (Drogba was his equal perhaps).
 
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Cassandra said:
For christ sake, let me point out few things to you:

- He didn't dictate the transfer fee and a price doesn't make somebody superhuman.

- He played 15-20 minutes yesterday, like he has in many matches this year, I can't understand how you can put a result down to a striker failing to convert 3 half chances in 15 minutes when for 70 minutes the rest of the team failed.

- People talk like 4 years ago he was scoring every chance he had, He wasn't, the difference is 4 years ago his confidence was higher, the teams he played for had faith in him and therefore played to his strengths, He was playing a lot more and therefore getting more chances.

- For me club and country missed a trick, his goal vs Barca was what I think the point where he regained his confidence, you saw that in the follow up QPR game. Then he was left out of the two most important games of his club career so far and to top that, not only do his country leave him out of their first game, but they choose to do so with no strikers, effectively saying they would rather play a negative system, than give one of the Worlds top strikers, who you would think after his re-assurances at Chelsea would have a HUGE hunger to prove himself, an opportunity to get himself back on the map.
Click to expand...

You sound like Torres' butt buddy. Too many excuses for a player who hasn't performed more than a couple times in close to 2 years now!

Half-chances?! :SHOCK:

Since when is a striker being put through on goal in 1-on-1 situations HALF chances?

The guy had 2 very clear goal-scoring chances and ruined both. What's worse is one of them, he could've easily simple passed to Navas who would have an EMPTY net to shoot at. But he was selfish yet didn't execute the chip properly and cost his national team 2 very important points. Something Villa would've easily taken care of.

And what's wrong with playing 20 mins or so against TIRED defences?! That's when most clear goal-scoring chances are made and Del Bosque gave Torres a huge chance bringing him on at the perfect time. Italy's defense was tired by then and many good chances were made. Unfortunately for them, they all fell to Torres who messed them up one after another.

Llorente must play next game and I agree with drekkard and lo zio saying Pedro or Navas must start because there are TOO many players who want to PASS and not enough playings making off the ball runs. Not enough penetrative runs and too many 'playmakers'. Spain needs some real 'width'. They need a real striker like Torres or Llorente along with Navas or Pedro (I have no preference and think both can do well) to come in for one of the many midfielders.

Like Gerd, I would play David Silva though and think if Spain uses him correctly, he can become Player of the Tournament. Iniesta was brilliant yesterday though and it's Fabregas that I would sacrifice.

It really is a shame Negredo and Torres were taken instead of Soldado and Villa. Now Llorente must become the main man for Spain
 
i think del bosque did everything right in playing possession ball until the defense is tired and only then bring on direct goal threats in torres and navas. and it really worked, they got great chances, you can't ask for more, can you? problem is, you only have 1 other sub left.
prandelli seems something else though, expect him to be a big international star come july.
 
PLF said:
You sound like Torres' butt buddy. Too many excuses for a player who hasn't performed more than a couple times in close to 2 years now!

Half-chances?! :SHOCK:

Since when is a striker being put through on goal in 1-on-1 situations HALF chances?

The guy had 2 very clear goal-scoring chances and ruined both. What's worse is one of them, he could've easily simple passed to Navas who would have an EMPTY net to shoot at. But he was selfish yet didn't execute the chip properly and cost his national team 2 very important points. Something Villa would've easily taken care of.

And what's wrong with playing 20 mins or so against TIRED defences?! That's when most clear goal-scoring chances are made and Del Bosque gave Torres a huge chance bringing him on at the perfect time. Italy's defense was tired by then and many good chances were made. Unfortunately for them, they all fell to Torres who messed them up one after another.

Llorente must play next game and I agree with drekkard and lo zio saying Pedro or Navas must start because there are TOO many players who want to PASS and not enough playings making off the ball runs. Not enough penetrative runs and too many 'playmakers'. Spain needs some real 'width'. They need a real striker like Torres or Llorente along with Navas or Pedro (I have no preference and think both can do well) to come in for one of the many midfielders.

Like Gerd, I would play David Silva though and think if Spain uses him correctly, he can become Player of the Tournament. Iniesta was brilliant yesterday though and it's Fabregas that I would sacrifice.

It really is a shame Negredo and Torres were taken instead of Soldado and Villa. Now Llorente must become the main man for Spain
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Since when is a striker being put through on goal in 1-on-1 situations HALF chances?
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It wasn't even a 1-on-1 chance on both of his chances. There were a defender at the left but you must know he is trying to score against one of the greatest keeper in the world. Just see how Van Persie, Villa, Henry, Ronaldo and all the greatest strikers missed. It's football, you can't expect him to score on every chances.

The guy had 2 very clear goal-scoring chances and ruined both.
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He made those chances by himself and it's never clear goal-scoring chances. You don't even have an idea of being a striker.

And what's wrong with playing 20 mins or so against TIRED defences?
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Think twice before writing. Those defenders weren't tired, they just pushed the defensive line and that's why Italy has the world's best defense.

It really is a shame Negredo and Torres were taken instead of Soldado and Villa
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Villa is injured, even a kid knows it. Soldado having fitness problem and not suiting on the current Spain tactics.



Stop blaming 1 person when a team couldn't won it.
 
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