Arsenal Thread

gerd said:
Could have been Fernando Torres (for Liverpool) last year or Alexander Hleb a couple of years ago...they're bound they say things like that and don't give me the "he's different" talk.

Come next season he could be playing for Man City or Spurs...and then you would be furious...
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I think with him being out injured for long periods over the last 4 years he feels he has alot to prove in an Arsenal shirt. So I do think it is a bit different to the Torres and Hleb scenaarios. He has a connection with the club that i don't think Torres had with Liverpool and definately not with what Hleb had with Arsenal.

Torres only loved Liverpool when he was doing well imo. Hleb didn't appreciate what he had at Arsenal and was never loved by the fans and he wasn't really with us long enough to have a connection with the club.

Van Persie on the other hand has been with us for years is loved by the fans and has a lot to prove in an Arsenal shirt. So I do think the situation is different and he is different as a person.

You have this inclination to put all football players in the same pot Gerd it is a very cynical way of thinking and narrow minded. They are humans aswell and all have different morals, ways of thinking and ambitions.

EDIT: I would like to also say if he does go it will depend on if he can stay fit until the end of the season and how much is offered for him. I think it will be more the club than Van Persie that will accept the move, if the money is too good to turn down for a player that is injury prone.

I really hope he doesn't go, but I am confident he won't put in a request to leave or push to leave the club.
 
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Well Bobby you call me cynical and narrow minded. I have no problems wit that.
My impression is that English fans are extremely naïve and "romantic" in those things (and apparently some Brazilians too).
Like i already siad dozens of times: they are professionals, they are thinking in terms of "carreer" and not in terms of loyalty (or love) towards a club. Somebody in this thread (and i think it was you Bobby) that it is not a profession like any other...i don't agree with that...almost every profession is like any other once you are in it.
Yes there are players that stay loyal to one club, but they are big exceptions, players like Le Tissier. I'm not even thinking about players like Giggs and Scholes, because for those players it was "easy" to stay loyal to the most succesfull club in the world (did i actually wrote that?).

There is one part where i agree with you: i also think that Van Persie thinks he still has something to give back (or to prove) to Arsenal. But the cynical/ narrow minded in me is sure that this would not stop him to ask for a transfer if he gets a better or more attractive offer. If Wigan would do an offer, Van Persie will stay at Arsenal. But imagine Barcelona making an offer for Van Persie...are you sure that Van Persie will stay at Arsenal? I'm pretty sure he will ask for a transfer.
 
gerd said:
Well Bobby you call me cynical and narrow minded. I have no problems wit that.
My impression is that English fans are extremely naïve and "romantic" in those things (and apparently some Brazilians too).
Like i already siad dozens of times: they are professionals, they are thinking in terms of "carreer" and not in terms of loyalty (or love) towards a club. Somebody in this thread (and i think it was you Bobby) that it is not a profession like any other...i don't agree with that...almost every profession is like any other once you are in it.
Yes there are players that stay loyal to one club, but they are big exceptions, players like Le Tissier. I'm not even thinking about players like Giggs and Scholes, because for those players it was "easy" to stay loyal to the most succesfull club in the world (did i actually wrote that?).

There is one part where i agree with you: i also think that Van Persie thinks he still has something to give back (or to prove) to Arsenal. But the cynical/ narrow minded in me is sure that this would not stop him to ask for a transfer if he gets a better or more attractive offer. If Wigan would do an offer, Van Persie will stay at Arsenal. But imagine Barcelona making an offer for Van Persie...are you sure that Van Persie will stay at Arsenal? I'm pretty sure he will ask for a transfer.
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I do think alot of players act how you are talking about. But all I am saying is that you can't think of everyplayer in the same way. There are different levels of loyalty a player can have to a club.

Players have different motivations, Van Persie is an intelligent guy and he might think that moving to Barcelona will limit his chances of first team action, so might not want to leave? He may look at other players that have left and been unsuccesful at Barcelona from Arsenal etc.

Professional players play football from an extremely young age, they put their whole life into the game, they support teams and make a living playing a game they love. You can't compare that like for like for all professions. Does a banker dream of being a banker from the age of 5 and go to banking school from 6 onwards with the soul aim of being a banker? does he support and follow HSBC from a young age and scream with joy when they make record profits when he is a boy? etc etc.

Being a footballer is different alot of players will be about the money, but alot of players will want the success and to be a part of a successful team. This is the only reason Van Persie might leave for Barca, because he hasn't won much with Arsenal. But if I had a short career as a footballer and had been playing since I was a boy and I felt my footballing career was passing me by, then I might think of getting some success somewhere. That doesn't mean Van Persie is being unloyal. Arsenal fans will not begrudge the move because they know he gave 100% for us when he played, jsut like that with Fabregas.

We will see anyway :DD
 
Well let's hope Arsenal can eliminate Barcelona, maybe this might change Cesc's mind. Personally i think he is better off at Arsenal than with Barcelona.

Cesc is a serious underestimated player...he is absolutely brilliant.
 
I doubt Cesc will change his mind...but here's to hoping anyway :DD

Anyway another replay :ROLL: the team we had out today should have been able to do a job out there. Just an extra fixture that we really didn't need.
 
sattan_hussein said:
It's understandable that the likes of Rosicky and Chamakh played for the draw, they want to play more games. :P
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Even though Rosicky scored with a header! :LOL:

Wow, I guess yesterday's match was a way of bringing us back to Earth after defeating Barcelona.

I wasn't even too upset when they scored the equaliser, because Arsenal was taking it for granted, playing bureaucratic, casual and Sunday League-like football. IMO it was disrespectful even if they are such a fragile team.

From that game we could also learn about Almunia's terrible form, Gibbs can't defend for his life and Psycho-Squilla is just chaotic! Our last choice of defender IMO.
Oh, and also, that Tehohé (is it his name?) is a menace! :P
 
Not very convincing tonight but a great 3 points and keeps the pressure on Man United.

Lets hope that Cesc and Theo aren't too badly injured. Looks like Walcotts could be bad?...I really hope not :((
 
Yeah, the 3 points are very important at home for a change.
I didn't watch the game, but my mate told me that Prem's favourite rugby side was set out to kick Arsenal players again... Were the injuries related to any dirty tackle?

Apparently Walcott and Fab are out of Sunday's final. If so, that's a big blow :(
 
Theo's out, has a sprained ankle thanks to a clumsy Whelan falling on his legs, and Fabs did his hamstring again but might still play... Overall Stoke were not dirty, just bad footballers who accidentaly kick those who can play.
 
Stoke just looked limited. but they didn't even try to play football. and when there was a Delap throw in I almost went metal with these kind of tactics.

Jack and Sczeszny are grrrreeat! Almunia can plant himself two extra arms i can't see him playing ahead of the kid.
 
I heard Stoke couldn't connect 3 passes last night and were shockingly shite!

I'm sad to see that Arsenal still didn't take my suggestion to use buckets of water to dip the ball in for Delap's throw ins :P
 
From all of the reports I have read and the comments from Wenger, it sounded like Stoke didn't play that rough and did try and play a game of football.

I don't mind teams playing defensive and playing to their strengths. Every team has their way of playing and that should be embraced. Teams want to win and it is very rare you can have a team that plays nice football, because to get the technically superior players you need to pay more money, get lucky in the transfer market, even then they will want to move on if they are at a 'less established' club.

You can be strong and forceful without going in dangerously on people and using dirty tactics. This is the only problem I have with these 'aggressive' teams, they can get results without being dirty.

Lets see how Birmingham play on Sunday :))
 
Fab definately out for the final. So Dissapointed :((

We will have to make sure we get into another final now so he can lead us into it.

Worrying for Sunday aswell as we will find it that much more difficult to break down Birmingham now. All it takes is a slip of concentration from the back and them going 1-0 up and then having every man behind the ball, then we are in big trouble.

Hopefully the team do us proud....fingers crossed!
 
Stokes were not aggressive Arsenal had the ball moving too much. Although, I think it was Delap that caught Sagna on a 1 footed studs up tackle. And Theo was brought down sloppy by Whitehead.

Cesc missing the final might be a good thing, He wants to have another final :BOP:

RVP and Kos back will be needed, besides I think Arshavin is more clever than Theo. I love how Narsi n Arshavin gave a show of skillz together towards the end of the match. Arshavin is on the up!!
 
Normally Birmingham can never be a problem for Arsenal. Even without Cesc.
IMO Walcott isn't that important for Arsenal.
He still has to make one step to become a really great player and it seems as if this takes him ages.
 
It will be a very one-sided final, like the won we had against Wigan in 2006, where we won 4-0.

Walcott is a bit more than just "one step" away from becoming a really great player. He needs to show the consistency of the likes of Nani and Nasri before we can start expecting him to become a great player.
 
Sounds to me like you've barely seen Nani this season. 20 goals/assists in 21 Premiership starts so far this season.

Neither of the three are the finished article. Difference is Nani and Nasri have shown a consistent creative and goal threat this season that Walcott has yet to show in his career.
 
Walcott has shown real quality finishes, speed and control. he's expected to be the creative winger, when i think he's more of a forward.
he does need to improve more. he's expected to be a star because he's been bought with tones of money from a young age.
i do think he will deliver in an year or two.
 
He might not be the finished product yet but from what I see this season, Theo improved a lot. Both technically and mentally. He just needs more playing time to be more consistant. Let's hope he doesn't stay too long off the pitch, cause that's what makes it so hard for him to have consistency.
 
Aboutreika18 said:
Sounds to me like you've barely seen Nani this season. 20 goals/assists in 21 Premiership starts so far this season.

Neither of the three are the finished article. Difference is Nani and Nasri have shown a consistent creative and goal threat this season that Walcott has yet to show in his career.
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Nasri is seen as the big thing at Arsenal because he won us some important games, whereas Theo is just a sidekick next to our many talents.

But when you look at stats, you can't say Walcott lacks consistency this season. He is the third Arsenal player most involved in goals with 7 goals and 6 assists in the league, only behind Arshavin (5+11) and RVP (10+5). Nasri himself got 9+1 (only one assist? crazy.)

Theo is just a weapon in the hands of our midfield, and he's made an incredible contribution as such. Like n4p4st4 said he's a forward, you can't expect him to run the show like Nani does.
 
Walcott needs to improve on the ball and his delivery, but his goal return at this stage of his development is impressive, he could become a goal machine.

Gerd regarding Nani, Their isn't a more consistent, wide player in world football(excluding Ronaldo and Messi)
 
Walcott HAS improved. He's on his way. He's doing well I think and making gradual improvements in lots of little ways. Still a LONG way for him to go though as I'm not the biggest fan and it' his decision making which I find most annoying! Electing the wrong option of who to pass to or even 'when' to release that pass... and when to go on his own... when to go for a shot instead of passing, etc. But that's understandable as he's still getting integrated to the team and still young and gaining experience.... he's already improved in this regard even.

But the kid has improved over the last year or so and am confident will continue to improve. To be honest, I never fully expect him to become anything AMAZING anyway, but he's already a good player and I think can still get a lot better.

Don't expect him to become a future world player of the year though. For all his pace, the football brain is not quite there always and although it's developing nicely, I wouldn't be too surprised if after an initial phase of improvement and turning into a good player, he then starts to fall off the map little by little as he gets older much like other former 'hot prospects who were fast' did ala Shaun Wright-Phillips or Kieran Dyer who was extremely highly rated as well. Though in the latter case, there were a lot of injury problems but there were a lot bigger issues as well.

Theo I have much more faith in than the former 2 mentioned, nonetheless, I never quite saw the hype and still don't expect him to become one of the world's true greats. He's a useful player though especially with counter-attacks and I think still has lots of room for improvement and I expect and hope for him to fulfill his potential which is quite big.
 
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