Arsenal Thread

I think Jonney won't be pleased to hear our season is over as early as Feb.

Very poor from Arsenal today. No sense of urgency at all, too much dwelling on the ball and not enough chances created. I'm tired of some players whose end product is none.

Gervinho is the main one here. Rosicky gave him an easy goal and he wasted it. Not a single accurate cross, abysmal passing. There was an occasion when he fell down all by himself, it was embarrassing really.
I'd rather get kicked in the nuts 10 times by Roberto Carlos than watch Gervinho play ever again.

Moreover I'm disgusted by the general team attitude and lack of urgency. With 10 min left there we didn't look like a team on the verge of being knocked out.

We must have like 1% chance of winning the CL, so pretty much season over for us. 4th place is our trophy.
 
PFF im a thousand miles away in philippines enjoy this sun and u can always count on arsenal ****ing things up.

jesus christ. i was very reluctant to check the scores abroad. wish i had not.
 
Wenger will have to go after this season. There ain't no two ways about it now.

How annoying and disrespectful to the fans it is to put on your 2nd string out for a key fixture in a competition we are much more likely to win. The Champions League is a bloody long shot, but the FA Cup I quite fancied Arsenal to go really far or hopefully winning it.

It comes to show how deluded Wenger is. Perhaps he thinks it is still 2005 and he has enough squad depth to rotate on 3 different fronts.
We are on the verge of being no longer having CL status, yet the manager completely underestimate the FA Cup to concentrate on the CL against opposition of such quality, let's face it, that we're very unlikely to go through.
Dammit, Bayern are league leaders with some 15 points to spare, but Bundesliga's 5th placed Schalke were able to give us a torrid time (and finish 1st in our group).

F*cking up the FA Cup in favour of the CL is like trying to borrow 50 quid when we'd already been denied a fiver several times.

It reeks of sheer arrogance if you ask me. Ok, we know Wenger is good, but he's not that good to pull off what he's trying to do here. The manager sells the players he chose to sell, bought the players who are failing again and again.
It's a fine mess, and it's all his now. I don't buy anymore into the argument that he is the only man capable of getting us out of this mess, because he simply isn't. And is not as if he's doing the right things to get out of it.

Even his player selections and decisions during the match left much to be desired. Rosicky was by a mile our best player yesterday, but when it was time to bring on our super trio Wilshere/Cazorla/Walcott, it was him who got subbed, instead of a lethargic and hesitant Diaby.
I've had enough with Wenger's infatuations with certain players and Diaby is one of them. He clearly favours Diaby ahead of many players, and let's face it, it's simply not working! How stubborn can this man be??

I thought Sagna could have played. This was a key match. Coquelin didn't do much wrong, but he ain't no fullback. And one mistake was enough to get us punished.

And Gervinho, oh heavens! What a joke of footballer, and what a blunder of Wenger to have signed that guy.
For the record, I've nothing personal against Gervinho and he seems even a likeable character, a positive nature, applies himself, etc. Alright, he's a good guy, but the thing is he is just not that good at kicking a ball, is he?

I spent most of today feeling numb about it but after reading Arseblog my anger got reignited. His post reminded me of how it was Gervinho's pathetic miss that had cost us that match against Bradford. I'm sure you all remember, playground stuff.

Gervinho is a joke of a player, mediocre at best, and I detected this a while ago. But now we've got facts: it is costing us dearly. It's costing us 2 cup exits only this season.

It's very poor man management what happens with some players too. A lot of leeway for the likes of Diaby, but Arshavin's career at the club is finished.
Ok, our perfect and in form front 3 is Giroud, Walcott and Podolski (and Cazorla can be improvised on the wings if the manager doesn't want to use the other attackers). But I find it unacceptable to field someone as mediocre as Gervinho and leave a player of the quality of Arshavin rotting on the sidelines.

I'm not saying Arshavin would have been the answer yesterday, because he doesn't play professional football for many months now. A 31 year old footballer needs match fitness and all that. All I'm saying that the fact he's left rotting out of the squad is not only his fault, motivation or what have you. I'd say this is very very poor man management from Arsene Wenger.

Losing to lower league opposition leads us to an old chronic problem we have, and it does my head in when players say they may have underestimated the opposition. This happens every now and then, and then we pick ourselves up, the players run a little bit more and give that little extra bit, and we improve our results... and then it happens again, we underestimate a weaker team (in a way we don't see other clubs in Arsenal's level doing).
This thing is a cycle and the underlying reason for this is, once again, down to the manager. By his attitude and team selection alone we can see a degree of arrogance. He is letting the team relapse and underestimate others again.

There's no ruthlessness in the dressing room (I can't think of Ferguson ever allowing that to happen). Plus, some players are too comfortable, knowing they can walk into the squad. Our keeper is one example.

I still shit my pants at the prospect of seeing Arsenal look up the market for managers and how Wenger's successor do. But the ways things are going, there is no change and the club is going backwards with Wenger. The club doesn't spend its money to stay in the same level as other clubs around us.

I think everyone (not just us fans, but football analysts and 'experts' and pundits) will agree that last season was a very close call and that the manager overachieved. Last season was supposed to be our turning point.
But next thing we know, we sell our best player to a team in our league which was already much stronger than us, and simply don't bring the same quality.
If we lose our CL place it will be no aberration, it will be just logic, the natural course in a league where the stakes are increased every season whilst we stick to a mentality of 10 years ago.

I was a bit confident we could finish above Spurs and snatch a CL spot, but what the hell did I know back then? Yet another cup exit at the hands of a lower division team, and now we got only Bayern to deal with. Knowing how mentally feeble this team is in such occasions it seems like the missing ingredient to spark Le Collapse.
I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not expecting anything good from this team anymore. In fact I'm expecting the worst possible outcome.
 
Arsenal will pick themselves right up. They got money, they got a huge stadium, they got a smart manager... have patience and everything will work out. Arsenal is a pestilence you won't easily get rid of. Sacking Wenger would most likely be most stupid move by the club in history, so for your sake I hope you hang on to him. Personally, I don't give a shit who manages Arsenal but Wenger has taken your club to the next level and now it is a transition period.
 
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Sabatasso said:
Arsenal will pick themselves right up. They got money, they got a huge stadium, they got a smart manager... have patience and everything will work out. Arsenal is a pestilence you won't easily get rid of. Sacking Wenger would most likely be most stupid move by the club in history, so for your sake I hope you hang on to him. Personally, I don't give a shit who manages Arsenal but Wenger has taken your club to the next level and now it is a transition period.
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have patience FUCK PATIENCE. WHAT IS IT NOW? 10 YEARS OF NOT COMPETING?

FUCK WENGER AND THE BOARD. THEY ALL RETARDS. 9/10 ARSENALS FANS PATIENCE HAS RAN OUT!! A FUCKING JOKE ARSENAL HAVE BECOME
 
Very good post, Rentboy. Well-written with a lot of thought into it.

I agree with every single one of your criticisms. They're really spot-on and this on-going situation rightfully calls for such heavy criticisms on Wenger and the team.

However, I personally still want Arsene to stay despite acknowledging that he has repeatedly committed serious mistakes that have cost the team. No, I do not think he will significantly change his habits or outlook, but what I do think is that he has managed to and still manages to produce a list of positives to partially offset those mistakes. Additionally, I feel that Wenger really can't be faulted fully for some of the setbacks we've experienced. In fact, he can be considered significantly unlucky in some terms and I sympathize with him.

One of those is the players' departures. You may disagree with me, but I fully sympathize with Wenger on this case. At the end of the day, some things are up to the character and loyalty of players. For example, VP spent years on our payroll as an under-performing, injury-ridden footballer who had yet to fill expectations of himself. After a season and a half of consistent football, he basically forced a transfer for himself. This is the playing field these days, with the club rendered almost helpless in the face of the player's desires. I don't need to mention specifically all the other names, but the list goes on and on. We all saw Wenger desperately fight it out for Fabregas, but one can resist only so long when your other options is losing your player on a free. Similar stories for Song, Hleb, Flamini, Nasri, Adebayor, etc. For years, anybody who shined a little has packed his bags and cried for an exit, literally stabbing Wenger and the club, who kept their faith in them and waited for them to grow into their potential, in the back. For me, it is really admirable that he still manages to speak respectfully of these players, as I would be tempted to call them out and degrade them.

And please, no one give me the "They left because they were tired of not winning" excuse. The players themselves are just as responsible for their failures on the pitch as Wenger, if not more. It is also up to them to not consistently f' up and let theirs fan and, especially, their manager down, who repeatedly protected them and shielded them from criticisms. I am confident if these players hadn't forced their exits and had stayed put, the club's recent records would have been significantly different. The players' escapes are more the cause of Wenger's situation than the other way around. And like I said, lots depend on the character and loyalty of the players. If I have the audacity to publicly state "My manager is like my second father," then I wouldn't leave him flat footed for the 'wolves' to devour. Just look at the likes of Totti, De Rossi, and Gerrard who could have easily had much more glorious and high-paying careers but chose to stay loyal to their fans and clubs. Arsenal lacks nothing in stature to these clubs and deserves the same amount of respect and devotion.

Secondly, I am mostly proud of Arsene's transfer policy. I never want Arsenal to overpay for any player or make panic buys. I think Wenger has shown with his latest string of buys that he is always looking to make quality additions to the squad. It is just that they are hard to come buy for their actual price. Podolski, Cazorla, Nacho, Giroud, Arteta, Mertesacker. These are a string of recent quality purchases. However, we have to realize that when buying players you can't completely devalue your current players. Yes, we need quality additions but lots of people are ready to completely write off many of our players who still have a lot to contribute, such as Ramsey. Just a couple of months ago, people were calling Giroud 'Chamakh 2.0' but he has proven them wrong and shown that he is an asset. As a manager, you have no option but to benefit from your players (Unless you can throw 10 million euros of investment in the trash and buy a 20 million euro replacement). This is why I can't blame him for insisting on the likes of Gervinho who was one of the most influential players in the Lille side who became champions and is a key player for a strong Ivory Coast side (they are especially overloaded with talent up top, and he still manages to get playing time and contribute). I feel Gervinho's issue is mostly psychological, but I do agree that he needs to solve his issues and start pulling his weight. He is used up almost all of his credit, but as a manager you have to try and revive your investment. We can't just call for his head, then both Gervinho and the club lose. If he succeeds, then both the club and he succeeds. Just look at Chelsea. They are also insistent on Torres for the exact same reason. The difference is that, for them 50 million euros is an unwastable investment, where for us that amount is more like 10-15 million euros.

The financial restraints on the club are not just imaginary ones. They're real as it gets. And honestly, Wenger is the last person to blame for super-rich clubs acting totally irresponsible and insane, and UEFA failing to instill any financial fair play rules. To me it is as if, a few strong lobbied clubs were fixing games and UEFA overlooking the situation; then coming in to blame Wenger for also not having such influential lobby groups and not attempting to buy out matches. Personally, even if it was the contrary and Arsenal was without all financial restrictions, I would still prefer an idealistic approach rather than a greedy purchasing approach like City or Chelsea. The stadium is now paid off and sponsor money is coming, as we all know. I would like Wenger to now show some more ambition and flexibility, but still I do not want him to go nuts and buy a completely new squad. I prefer the more romantic and more sensible route. Quality players for reasonable prices. Also let's not forget, not only Wenger's players have been hijacked from him for the past years, but also his transfer targets. Most recently, Mata, Hazard, and Zaha come to mind.

I know we have heard these 'excuses' as some may call them. But they are not minor details. They are immense factors that are being really overlooked and underestimated.

For me, I am satisfied to see Arsenal as this sort-of beacon of idealism in football. Please, nobody come in and say that "But Arsenal also do this and they also do that." At the end of the day, there really is only a handful of clubs left in football who have any ideals and principles what-so-ever. And yes, maybe Arsenal also infringe on the dark-side sometimes from the perspective of smaller clubs, but, for me, what they are doing is admirable regardless. I do want the club to be ambitious and competitive and not just be content on adhering to these principles, but, also, I won't bash them to death for not being so successful.

Yes, Wenger really has some stubbornness in him and some of his decisions really seem poor. Rentboy really touched on a lot of what's wrong with the current picture. But evaluating the situation with slightly different criteria produces different conclusions. I do not expect Wenger to radically transform himself and his policies. I think he is changing just like everything and everyone else does day by day, year by year. I think his latest signings and the Walcott saga speak volumes for his recent adaptations and his lessons learned the hard way. If he stays he will continue with this project with mostly the same positives and the same negatives and stubbornness. I don't know how to wrap all this up, but basically I like Wenger and I wish for him to stay and continue his project.

Also, I don't get people asking for Jurgen Klopp or some other managers who basically apply the same model at their current clubs. Don't get me wrong, I am fan of Klopp, but Just look at Dortmund. They've basically had to sell their top talent to the more financially powerful top-dogs of Europe just as Arsenal. They've had to part ways with Barrios, Nuri Sahin, Kagawa, and will have a tough time holding on to players like Hummels, Subotic, Gotze, Reus, and Lewandowski. It's just unavoidable that cash-strapped clubs will swoop in to temp these players away from the club. It's just that no one has complained about Dortmund's situation because people do not perceive them as the same stature as Arsenal and have lower expectations from them. But the reality is, in terms of finances, they're on more comparable grounds as both clubs are attempting to thrive from their own mean. Also, since Dortmund have benefited financially from these transfers, people look at their persistence to be successful in admiration. Arsenal and Wenger have been doing the same thing for years now, but no one is impressed by Arsenal's financials successes or football resilience.

Thanks to anyone who took the time to read... :)
 
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Great post AK.Rabona :TU:

Rentboy how was Wenger being disrespectful to anybody putting out that team? I really find it hard sometimes with the things you come out with.

The team completely dominated that game and should have scored quite a few times, the reason they didn't was because of the players themselves.

If we were outplayed and lost, then I could understand why you might (just might) think that it was disrespectful and not caring for the FA Cup. But the team he put out was more than capable of winning that game comfortably, while we rested players and could put out a rested team for the Champs league game.

It was all well managed in that respect, what was wrong with what he did? The truth is that the team performed all but putting the ball in the back of the net (Which is the most important of course) but Wenger can't get on the pitch and score the goals himself, the players have to take responsibility.

Of course Wenger has to take responsibility for the players that he brought in that did not perform, but to question Wenger on buying Gervinho is just silly. The guy was the top player of a team that one their respective league, he had a great assist and goalscoring record and the position he played and his style of play seemed like it would fit very well in the 4-3-3 system that we play in. The only thing you can accuse Wenger of is not seeing into the future and I think if you really want him to do that then you are living in La La land.

I don't disagree with you that Wenger should maybe go next season (I still don't want it to happen) but the only reason I would, is because I think he has instilled a mental weakness in our team, that it seems like he can't overcome. This is the only reason I think we are losing like we are and it has to fall to Wenger.

Accusing Wenger of being disrespectful and Arrogant on that FA cup performance is just poor imo. The team didn't win, Wenger put more than enough on the pitch and did enough...but the players didn't.

...and Jonney how have you added a few years onto us not competing for things? :LOL: the angrier you get the more years get added on to the stats ;))
 
AK Rabona, good post. I agree with the underlying conclusion (people blame Wenger more than he deserves), but not with all the thing you bring up.

First of all the outgoing players: they did leave bevause they were tired of not winning (that was most certainly the case for both RVP and Fabregas and you can't blame them). Maybe you should imagine yourself being an important Arsenal player like Arteta or Cazorla (or in the past RVP and Fabregas). Year after year there is pressure from the fans to win silverware (very irrealistic pressure because you damn well know as a player that other clubs have more money and can attract better players). And then you see that you manager buys players he never uses (Chamakh, Park), or plays them constantly blatantly out of position (Ramsey, Gervinho, Arshavin) or has players with huge contracts and hardly uses them (Arshavin). If you have given your all for that club, in the end you want to leave. You want to leave and this not only for the money but because you are a sports animal and those people want to win. Players like RVP, Fabregas and Nasri also left because they could play under Ferguson (i don't like the man, but he is the best manager ever), play with the Messi for the team of your city or play with players like Aguëro, Balotelli, Tevez and Kompany.... You can't blame these players and in a way somehow Wenger might be blamed for their departure.

About Dortmund: the pressure on Dortmund to perform is much, much higher than the pressure on Arsenal. Historically Dortmund is as big a club in Germany as Arsenal in England and currently Dortmund is competing with Bayern to be the best club inGermany....Arsenal are nowhere near. I also think that Dortmund have much more fans in Germany) than Arsenal (in England).

Nevertheless i sort of agree with you on Wenger. It would not be just to sack him. On the other hand it might be necessay. Sometimes change is needed for club, players and manager. If Arsène would go that might be a good thing for both Arsenal, him and his new club...
 
Yeah I have no doubt that that players left because they wanted to win things, but also money was involved with quite a few as well.

But a lot of players did not give their all. The only players I can say 100% that did was Fabregas and Song really that have left recently. Van Persie I believe did but had a lot of his Arsenal career out injured (Alot of his best years) so there will always be a feeling that he legged it at the best possible moment for himself.

Wenger could not do much to keep most of those players at the club, so I don't really blame him.

You can blame him for not being successful and them wanting to leave because of it, but those players were also part of the non success.

I don't know if you can blame Wenger too much though, he shows players a lot of respect and patience, especially when they are not going through the best of times, then as soon as they start producing they then use this to move onto another club.

No doubt that players leave because they want to win things though, but it is a vicious circle, because you try and build a team that can win things and if you do not win things soon enough, then those players leave, then you have to start again and those players leave. But if all of the players stayed, they would have probably had a great chance of winning things and had a much more staring role in the Arsenal team.

Anyway it is pointless really, Arsenal aren't doing great and it has to ultimately go down to Wenger as the same fundamental mistakes are happening year after year...it has to be stopped somehow. Wenger needs to change some things and accept certain things, or he needs to move on.
 
Yeah, great post AK! Cheers for that.
And wow, posting all that via mobile phone?? Wow! Good job! :D
Look, I think I was where you are right now (when I had more patience and trusted Wenger).

Don't get me wrong, I admire Wenger a lot. He is not the perfect manager (I'll touch on that later). But I do like him a lot. He is a man of principle trying to do things the right and sensible way, albeit working in an industry that has lost all traces of connection to the real world. What happens right now with the game is sickening indeed, to see cash ruling everything like that. Not to sound like a hypocrite, I'll go as far as saying Arsenal is a part of that too, and I was already disgusted with footballers' salaries in the region of £30-40k a week. But what we have nowadays in the Sugar Daddy FC era, where we see £150-200k a week, I don't even have words for that anymore. It's beyond indecent.

However, you have to face that. In the words of Henry, "football is football" :D
And it is what it is nowadays. If Wenger doesn't agree, he should pack his things and call it a day.

The fact Wenger is backstabbed by all the players you mentioned is not exactly bad luck. Wenger can't hope to be a father figure to those players and expect their loyalty. This is business after all, and it's nothing personal. The fact that Wenger never openly criticises these guys suggest that he knows it too. It's just business. The players will go to the highest bidders, and that's all there is to it.

When players say they wanted to move "to win things" I don't believe it for a minute, in most cases. If you were a professional footballer, would you turn down £150k a week?
It just so happens that the teams paying such salaries are the ones winning stuff. Coincidence?

If I may be so bold, let me put this another way: if Arsenal had been winning the Premier League every season whilst having a £60k a week average wage bill, our best players would still go to City, Chelsea and United anyway, to earn 2 or 3 times more than that.
Have you ever heard a player saying they are going to this or that team because "they are excited about their project"? Yeah, project is the big word here. It sums up the following: those teams will pay absurd amounts to have the best players, and by having the best players they will win stuff.

I've heard this phrase before. It was coined by the first waves of mercenaries in football. I remember Robinho saying that when he moved to City. Back then City didn't win f*ck all, but Robinho was right about the project. The only thing is that he didn't stay to reap the rewards (through faults of his own).

I hear what you're saying about players as Gerrard, Totti and De Rossi. But these guys are a rarity today in football. We may be able to expect that from Jack Wilshere. But for the most part, we are a victim of our own ways. We recruit the best talent in Europe for the best price we can get. And then we get them very young from Feyenoord, Barcelona, from Africa, from Ligue 1, etc. But these guys don't have that same involvement with the club. They came to Arsenal to have their big break in football and to make money. They are looking after their careers and always will continue to do so.

Wenger, having the job that he has, must be perfectly aware of all this. If he doesn't, then he's too naive to work in this industry.

The bit about the players, such as Gervinho, it gets on my nuts but obviously Wenger knows them better than anyone else. Song couldn't put a foot right when he came to this club but Wenger turned him into a very good footballer. Maybe those players who underperform will come good. But the question is, can we afford to wait? Are we a football academy or a club? The way things are right now, Gervinho is costing us cup exits.

What's more, it's hard to imagine or understand how Wenger insists in people who might come good, who have the potential... and completely give up on others who already are notoriously talented.

I'll agree that the financial constraints and the sugar daddy clubs have put a dent on Wenger's ambitions, but that's no excuse to the humiliation of late. When we suffer cup exits from Bradford and Blackburn it seems there's another deep underlying problem.

To me it seems Wenger is too soft, lenient and tolerant with most of his players' shortcomings. One would expect a proper bollocking of a half-time talk against Blackburn, but there was no signs of that.
We truly needed a missing quality on Wenger, which is put the fear of the Lord into these players. To me, they seem like a bunch of spoilt kids right now. A hair dryer treatment or what have you, wouldn't be a bad thing.


BobbyBox said:
Rentboy how was Wenger being disrespectful to anybody putting out that team? I really find it hard sometimes with the things you come out with.

The team completely dominated that game and should have scored quite a few times, the reason they didn't was because of the players themselves.
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Not only the team he picked, but the lacklustre, half-hearted performance. I think it's disrespectful for the fans who pay top pound for tickets (I don't need to keep banging on the same drums). It shows, too, a bit of carelessness and arrogance to underestimate our opposition like we did.
The players f*cked it up, I know Wenger can't go score those goals, but he was the one who bought the players, he selects his team and he is the one in charge of adjusting tactics during a match (or lack of adjustment, should I say).

If you're not convinced by my words, I'll resort to the words of the manager himself and the captain:


Arsene Wenger:
Maybe they still thought: ‘OK, we’re playing at home against Blackburn, it will be difficult but we will win the game anyway’, but it doesn’t work like that.
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Thomas Vermaelen:
I think the tempo could have been higher sometimes. I think we had too many touches on the ball, didn’t respect the game sometimes.
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Moreover, I don't really think we so clearly dominated that game as you suggest. It was illusory domination through possession, but quite frankly I thought Blackburn dealt with us quite comfortably most of the time.
The Gervinho miss was the only clear cut chance we created. There was that Rosicky rocket against the crossbar and Arteta hitting the side netting, but those were not chances we normally try to create. They came by and the players tried to seize it, because dammit, Wenger even gets angry when our players try a long range effort! Which is one of the things that annoy me a lot.

What Blackburn did against us? It was the most basic of things: put men behind the ball. And it worked!
We were not only lethargic and lumbering around without much end product, but we were predictable too.
During the 2nd half I spotted Giroud several times trying to get on the end of (poor) crosses whilst surrounded by 3 Blackburn centre halves! Why not stick another CF in there? It's a cup tie and we're on the verge of being knocked out! Oh, we don't have another natural CF? Use Podolski there, or Walcott. Anything, but try to dig out the goal we need! FFS, instead we see the team stuck in that static formation trying the same thing we always do.

We've been here before, it's all very familiar. Wenger seems incapable of changing the shape and formation of his team. It's always like for like substitutions and it got really old. Teams know exactly what to do to deal with us. Having the wingers cross to a lone centre forward all game long when he (Giroud) is outnumbered is very poor showing.

When we played Sunderland we were so much more direct and urgent. That was what I missed about Arsenal, but I guess that was a one-off. We are back to our old selves, overworking innocuous possession and incapable of breaking down a team who is doing only the simplest of things (parking the bus and hoofing it up).

When I say Arsene Wenger's time should be up, I say it not only for the sake of change, but I think he is an outdated manager. I think a more modern and audacious manager would have approached that game against Blackburn in a much more different way. And at least react properly to a situation that wasn't working for us halfway through.

Of course there are the issues off the pitch, inside the books with players' wage structure and all that, still to fix. But if it isn't Wenger to sort it our, someone else will. It doesn't have to be him. In fact, if he stays we have no indication of a change whatsoever.
Things cannot go on like this for any longer.
 
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Rentboy said:
What's more, it's hard to imagine or understand how Wenger insists in people who might come good, who have the potential... and completely give up on others who already are notoriously talented.
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Notoriously talented, but way past their best.

Rentboy said:
To me it seems Wenger is too soft, lenient and tolerant with most of his players' shortcomings. One would expect a proper bollocking of a half-time talk against Blackburn, but there was no signs of that.
We truly needed a missing quality on Wenger, which is put the fear of the Lord into these players. To me, they seem like a bunch of spoilt kids right now. A hair dryer treatment or what have you, wouldn't be a bad thing.
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Why would he give them a bollocking at half time when they are in complete control of a game? and you don't know what was said anyway.

Why do people use the phrase 'Hairdryer' anyway? always got to me, so very camp. It should be an industrial wind maker or something, a hair dryer isn't that strong and usually used by women to do their hair?

Rentboy said:
Not only the team he picked, but the lacklustre, half-hearted performance. I think it's disrespectful for the fans who pay top pound for tickets (I don't need to keep banging on the same drums). It shows, too, a bit of carelessness and arrogance to underestimate our opposition like we did.
The players f*cked it up, I know Wenger can't go score those goals, but he was the one who bought the players, he selects his team and he is the one in charge of adjusting tactics during a match (or lack of adjustment, should I say).

If you're not convinced by my words, I'll resort to the words of the manager himself and the captain:


Arsene Wenger:


Thomas Vermaelen:
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Again the team were more than capable of winning the game comfortably, it doesn't matter if you put those quotes because it doesn't prove to me that Wenger was disrespectful to anybody at all. Those quotes prove that the players once again underestimated and put in a half hearted performance in. Wenger was not disrespectful to anybody putting that team out.

He bought those players that have played very well in games this season, he can't predict that they are not going to put in 100% in a game and not perform to the best of their abilities. When the players he bought actually play well and give their best then the results are much more favourable.


Rentboy said:
Moreover, I don't really think we so clearly dominated that game as you suggest. It was illusory domination through possession, but quite frankly I thought Blackburn dealt with us quite comfortably most of the time.
The Gervinho miss was the only clear cut chance we created. There was that Rosicky rocket against the crossbar and Arteta hitting the side netting, but those were not chances we normally try to create. They came by and the players tried to seize it, because dammit, Wenger even gets angry when our players try a long range effort! Which is one of the things that annoy me a lot.
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We were completely the better team in all respects and should have won the game by at least a couple of goals, but we didn't, through the team not giving enough and players not playing as good as they can do. But we had 26 shots half of which on target and a large proportion of the game controlled, we didn't finish our chances, but we made chances and should have scored on several occasions, but didn't.

It makes me laugh when you say Wenger gets angry when we have long shots :LOL: when has he ever said anything of the sort? It's one of the things that annoys you the most and you have just made it up. :LOL:


Rentboy said:
What Blackburn did against us? It was the most basic of things: put men behind the ball. And it worked!
We were not only lethargic and lumbering around without much end product, but we were predictable too.
During the 2nd half I spotted Giroud several times trying to get on the end of (poor) crosses whilst surrounded by 3 Blackburn centre halves! Why not stick another CF in there? It's a cup tie and we're on the verge of being knocked out! Oh, we don't have another natural CF? Use Podolski there, or Walcott. Anything, but try to dig out the goal we need! FFS, instead we see the team stuck in that static formation trying the same thing we always do.

We've been here before, it's all very familiar. Wenger seems incapable of changing the shape and formation of his team. It's always like for like substitutions and it got really old. Teams know exactly what to do to deal with us. Having the wingers cross to a lone centre forward all game long when he (Giroud) is outnumbered is very poor showing.
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This bit I can agree with, Wenger needs to do something and adapt to what is happening, not just continue what he is doing. It isn't working and if he doesn't change it, he just looks silly, especially because I think we do have the players to do well, but they are not performing and this needs to go down to Wenger.
 
The Premier League has declined, it is no longer the best league in the world. Arsenal has declined along with it, but they are exactly where they've been for a long while. Hunting the fourth spot with a chance on third, so basically nothing has changed and still you whine like a bunch of poor kids in the candy store.

Arsenal is punching exactly where they're supposed to when you consider their financial strength, they are in the run for CL spot, they're currently in the CL and they're occasionally playing great football. THINGS ARE COMPLETELY NORMAL... the only reason why you're so bent out of shape is because Spurs has established themselves as an equal club in terms of money and squad strength.

Arsenal will continue to be a top club in PL for a heck of a long time, because the club is run by people with more brains than this particular forum can sport. If you want more than you currently got, then you need to find a Quatari oil baron to buy your club and to invest an insane amount of money to buy ridiculously overpaid superstars who will occasionally perform at their top level.

Arsenal just spent a lot of money on new players, Cazorla and Podolsky are very good buys and that french powerforward can surely become good. If Arsenal lacks anything at the moment it is some depth in the holding midfielder spot and possibly a decent striker that can push first team spot. Spurs has the same issues if not more so, they lack depth in vital areas as do all other clubs except City and United. Chelsea will most likely cover any holes in the near future, as usual.
 
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There`s a lot of damn writing on here ffs! so much writing how can you get your point across. Rentboy makes me go to the darkside and bobby bring me back to the light.

Ive learn that the past is to remember not to make those mistakes and never wish for the past. The future`s expectation is far more exciting and you never know .... Fans are too loyal to a person`s accomplishment and rightly so. When does the club pick what`s best for the club.

I believe in life ppl are placed for a certain important time. Wenger has sought out the growth of the club,stadium,and future in great standing(financial). He today is running on his accomplishment. That like me telling my wife to remember the honeymoon and the days of courtship . The reality is he is upset with the media for asking questions and he should know today its about result or move on. He should look what`s best for the Club and not his reputation , Rentboy wins !


@Sabatasso there`s lot of clever points from your posting. Its not about Spurs coming up they been a spending force for years though nothing about them coming good. Its solely how we are moving forward. I don`t care about MCity, QPR or Chelsea its what Arsenal are doing and their everlasting transition due to selling players and whatnots .
 
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Bobby, I'm surprised you don't know about the infamous hairdryer treatment given by Ferguson, since you've been following the English league for much longer than I do. Or are you taking the piss? :P

In any case: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...-Alex-Fergusons-hairdryer-secret-success.html


As for Wenger, the only way to get him angry is to break the pattern of overworked tippy-tappy possession by trying an actual shot at goal for once.
Dude I'm not making this up, believe me. This doesn't happen too often (at least isn't captured on camera too often) but I saw quite a few of these. My most vivid memory of it comes from the previous match against Sunderland when Giroud could have passed to Cazorla but tried a shot from outside the box. The shot wasn't too far and could have sealed the game 2-0 for us at that point. But because it didn't, Wenger was shown on the touchline absolutely furious at Giroud.
That memory is very vivid also because I was most pleased with that performance against Sunderland, as we seemed to be trying to take our chances and not messing about with the ball. And then when Giroud took that shot (which he had every right to do) and Wenger got mad, I was like "F*ck off Wenger!" because I was so enjoying that!

I couldn't find a proper extended highlights of that match, but if you don't believe me go ahead and look for it.
 
Of course I know what the hair dryer is I just never got why it was such a ominous thing :LOL:

Maybe he was angry because the players around Giroud were not in a better position, maybe because the better option was to pass the ball etc etc just because you see him pissed off there can be quite a few reasons. Maybe they practiced in training what to do when in that situation and they didn't follow what was said? Therefore not creatin the better sceneario for a goal scoring chance erc etc

Lots of reasons. Anyway we agree that things need to change and The blame is with Wenger on the most part as he assembled the team etc please god let him sort it out.....hopefully In time for tomorrow ;))
 
I never get why people are so obsessed with those players leaving and winning more trophies. It has nothing to with the club itself. Yes, a few players would be a great addition to our squad, but these players did not win the trophies on their own. Look at how much money Chelsea and Manchester City spent. When you compare that to the amount of trophies they have won in the last years it is hardly impressive.

I would give anything to win the Champions League and just shut everyone up forever. Right now players are using the trophy drought as a bullshit excuse to leave for better salaries. If these players cared so much about winning trophies why didn't they stay to build a team? They're all selfish pricks who only care about money. Unfortunately, nowadays you need a team full of mercenaries to win I suppose...

That's why I find this witch hunt by the media and the people on us ridiculous. These people are same ones going around saying 'the amount of money footballers earn is ridiculous', but at the same time they are going around critizing Arsenal for not wanting to pay these 'ridiculous' amounts of money.

I'm sick of people critizing us. If anything we are the perfect example of how football should be. Investing in young players and turning them world class, instead of just buying every player and giving them 200k a week.

Also, a fair amount of those players had a minimal influence in winning those trophies. And I do not find the winning the Irish league a massive accomplishment.
 
Thing is Arsenal is a model club only lack trophies. We raise ticket prices and sell over priced popcorn ,but no one mentions irresponsible spending and such. I don`t care what players left and won trophies :LOL: We moved on they should too! had to laugh at Pennat wining the community shield :LOL: and loanee Adebayor !
 
Lots of talk about 'mercenaries' and 'ridiculous wages' on here and yet Arsene 'Mr. Principled' Wenger has won sod all for years whilst collecting around 150k a week.
 
I'd rather the manager got the ridiculous money than the players. He could have gone to a whole host of top clubs in his time. He chose to stay with us, so he doesn't really fall under the mercenary tag does he? He has been with us for 16 years and proven he can win things, has helped build (not with his hands obviously :PP) the emirates and put an infrastructure in place for us to be successful for the next 100 years (Maybe less :PP). So I don't think he has done 'Sod all' in that time. So should every manager that hasn't won anything in the last 8 years to have said to have done nothing? And not get the money they are on? Because that would be 95% of the managers in the world.

A manager being at a club for 16 years and bringing in trophies (not now I know), changing the ethos of the club, improving the image of the club throughout the world etc etc is much more deserving of lots more money than a player that hasn't really done anything in the game and signs a 5 year contract for it to not mean anything and move a year or so later.


Regarding that news article, The list of players that left and won a trophy should reflect players that didn't win anything with Arsenal and then went onto win things, then the list would make a lot more sense and would highlight the point better. Also not including players that hardly played for the first team and including nothing trophies like the community shield and the Irish leagues :LOL:
 
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I think Wenger is worth every penny he gets. Wenger has made bring Arsenal sexy for football fans like me.

Damjan, i really like Arsenal, but they are not as exemplary as you think they are, ask that in Beveren...(i know it will annoy people that i always come up with that argument, but i only use it to counter the fiction that Arsenal is an example whereas Chelsea or Man City aren't...).

What is happening now is something very normal in sports: dog eat dog. Arsenal has eaten Beveren because they had more money, now Arsenal sees an abyss between themselves and clubs like Chelsea, City and United. The reason is the same: money...

I don't buy the argument that Arsenal loose against the sugar clubs because they are a football club that is run like it should be and because Arsenal has principles. That is bullshit. If Arsenal would not have more money than (for example) Norwich, then they would not be better than Norwich. That is the way things are in football (unfortunately).
 
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BobbyBox said:
I'd rather the manager got the ridiculous money than the players. He could have gone to a whole host of top clubs in his time. He chose to stay with us, so he doesn't really fall under the mercenary tag does he? He has been with us for 16 years and proven he can win things, has helped build (not with his hands obviously :PP) the emirates and put an infrastructure in place for us to be successful for the next 100 years (Maybe less :PP). So I don't think he has done 'Sod all' in that time. So should every manager that hasn't won anything in the last 8 years to have said to have done nothing? And not get the money they are on? Because that would be 95% of the managers in the world.

A manager being at a club for 16 years and bringing in trophies (not now I know), changing the ethos of the club, improving the image of the club throughout the world etc etc is much more deserving of lots more money than a player that hasn't really done anything in the game and signs a 5 year contract for it to not mean anything and move a year or so later.


Regarding that news article, The list of players that left and won a trophy should reflect players that didn't win anything with Arsenal and then went onto win things, then the list would make a lot more sense and would highlight the point better. Also not including players that hardly played for the first team and including nothing trophies like the community shield and the Irish leagues :LOL:
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He hasn't won anything in 8 years, and yet he's something like the 4th highest paid manager in the world. He simply does not deserve it. And he has the nerve to moan about money and wages... You'd think that he'd do something about the ticket prices if he was earning his 7-8m a year doing something other than bringing success on the field!
 
Godotelli said:
He hasn't won anything in 8 years, and yet he's something like the 4th highest paid manager in the world. He simply does not deserve it. And he has the nerve to moan about money and wages... You'd think that he'd do something about the ticket prices if he was earning his 7-8m a year doing something other than bringing success on the field!
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If you look at trophies won in the last 8 years then so be it he is not worth it. We can come to the conclusion that nobody is worth that amount of money anyway. But I think most people within Arsenal look beyond the trophies and base his value on much more than trophies. Which again, most other clubs have to do with their clubs, because only a tiny percentage of all the teams in the world have continuous success. The same reason why Moyes has been at Everton for many years without winning much. A football team is much more than about winning trophies, otherwise there would only be a couple of teams in every league.

But the 'boss' should really get more than the 'workers' as they have more responsibility.

Wenger at Arsenal should be the highest paid, I don't think it matters what others get around the world.

I think people can have the nerve to moan about players wages and money, because that is really what is the problem. There are far less managers than players and imo the manager should get more money than any player. If every top manager got paid around 150k a week and the top players got around 50-70k a week tops it would be in a much better position than it is now.
 
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