cfdh_edmundo
Maverick
- 30 December 2002
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Ballardini is out of Lazio, it looks like Reja will replace him
Ballardini is out of Lazio, it looks like Reja will replace him
Serie A Thread - 2014/15 Season
- Thread starter Professor Nutmeg
- Start date
PLF
Legend
- 2 August 2004
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Yup Reja it is it seems.
And Thomas *The Hammer* Hitzsplsberger has joined Lazio too of course on the final days of transfer window. I wouldn't wanna be a teammate and have to block his or Kolarov's shots in training everyday!
Very well said as usual Ben.
Your points about most high potential players never fulfilling that promise is very valid and of course there are like a million factors.
My only thing is that sometimes when things like Bovo and Pinzi happens, I start doubting whether they were in fact ever high-potential in 1st place to begin with or at least as high as I thought. But you're right, I probably shouldn't second guess. They WERE. They just didn't get there like most.
Yup Reja it is it seems.
And Thomas *The Hammer* Hitzsplsberger has joined Lazio too of course on the final days of transfer window. I wouldn't wanna be a teammate and have to block his or Kolarov's shots in training everyday!
yeah bro,i definitely see your point about bovo and pinzi... also coz i shared the same expectations u had about them. and yes, at this stage of their carreers, we can say they didn't fulfill their real potential. Pinzi became a decent\good player... that kind of player that might come handy for any team....but he's definitely not as good as we (you and me) thought he would have become. Bovo became a pretty good cb, i'd say slightly above the italian average (and considering the standard quality of the italian average cb, that's definitely a good achievement), but he's not that special thing he seemed to be a few years ago (and even though he's still pretty young i don't think he'll get much better than he is right now).
but i don't think we should feel disappointed by their growth and i also don't think we were wrong in rating them as high potential youngsters a few years ago.
because, as a matter of fact, they really were "high potential youngsters". they just didn't fulfill their potential. wich is pretty common afterall.
i mean, for every generation we witness dozens of potential future world class youngsters, as in each and every generation there are usually plenty of extremely talented 19, 20, 22 years old youngsters. but by the time they reach 28 just a few of them actually reached that status, as talent alone isn't gonna bring u that far. it takes a lot more to become a top class players. and i'm not just talking about will, determination and hardwork, which are obviously as important as talent. i'm also talking about your "mental structure", your confidence, your faith in your own skills (i remember we talked about this when we talked about balotelli and montolivo and how mario is more likely to become a top class player than montolivo, precisely because of his "gutsyness").
it's also about having a well-defined personality: being aware of what u are and what u wanna become, having that strong personality and those "mental boundaries" that allow u to remain faithful to yourself, to stay focused on your goals and not get distracted by popularity.
and then there are also many other factors wich are just out of the players themselves's control; we might call it luck. at the end of the day, the most apparently insignificant circumstances can very well change our lives. the right transfer at the right time; having a good coach in the most important phase of your growth as a player, and so on.
so having high potential doesn't mean u will become a top class player (and, knowing u, i'm aware u already know this... much bettter than me probably).... it doesn't even mean u're more likely to become a top class player than any other less talented player.... it just means u have 1 of those many "features" required to reach that level.
if 5 years ago someone would have told me barzagli would have become nothing more than a decent cb, while chiellini would have turn out to be a top class cb, i would have never believed that.
and the same applies to the current young generation. we have many potential world class cbs out there right now: kjaer, evans, bocchetti, ranocchia and bonucci are the first names that come into my mind. but the only thing we can tell right now is that they seem to be on the right path. some of em are showing huge potential (ranocchia and bonucci), some others are already starting to perform as top class players (kjaer and evans).... but we can't very well say if any of them will actually be a top class player tomorrow. maybe some of em will make it... maybe none.... maybe 3 years from now, a cb we don't really rate right now will be much better than alll of em.... who knows?
that's why i try not to indulge in those "who's the next best thing?" conversations (although it's a strong temptation). coz it's such an aleatory subject. if we always keep in mind that talent is just one of those many factors required to turn a potential world class player into an actual top player, then we won't feel disappointed by those who "didn't make it".
Very well said as usual Ben.
Your points about most high potential players never fulfilling that promise is very valid and of course there are like a million factors.
My only thing is that sometimes when things like Bovo and Pinzi happens, I start doubting whether they were in fact ever high-potential in 1st place to begin with or at least as high as I thought. But you're right, I probably shouldn't second guess. They WERE. They just didn't get there like most.
lo zio
International
- 24 October 2005
- Palermo
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
yeah
i can already see reja telling the guys, "ok fellas, if u arrive late to the trainings or don't perform on matchday, you're gonna have to help kolarov and hitzlsperger in training their free kicks by providing them your bodies as a wall" i'm sure they'd rather pay a fine.
Yup Reja it is it seems.
And Thomas *The Hammer* Hitzsplsberger has joined Lazio too of course on the final days of transfer window. I wouldn't wanna be a teammate and have to block his or Kolarov's shots in training everyday!
yeah
i can already see reja telling the guys, "ok fellas, if u arrive late to the trainings or don't perform on matchday, you're gonna have to help kolarov and hitzlsperger in training their free kicks by providing them your bodies as a wall"
i'm sure they'd rather pay a fine.
Zeem
Wonder Boy
- 15 July 2006
- AC Milan
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
the number of sacked coaches is just frightening this season.
the number of sacked coaches is just frightening this season.
cfdh_edmundo
Maverick
- 30 December 2002
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
To be fair Ballardini was a lost cause, he didnt have too much experience and getting rid of Delio Rossi was big mistake by Lotito. In fact Lotito has pretty much run the club into ruin. When you think 3-4 years ago this was a team that got to the Champions League (drew with Real Madrid), was regularly in Europe (UEFA Cup), and has had some great players in the last few seasons (Oddo, Pandev, Ledesma, Behrami, Peruzzi, De Silvestri, Jimenez) - but for the most part due to problems with Lotito they've left the club.
To be fair Ballardini was a lost cause, he didnt have too much experience and getting rid of Delio Rossi was big mistake by Lotito. In fact Lotito has pretty much run the club into ruin. When you think 3-4 years ago this was a team that got to the Champions League (drew with Real Madrid), was regularly in Europe (UEFA Cup), and has had some great players in the last few seasons (Oddo, Pandev, Ledesma, Behrami, Peruzzi, De Silvestri, Jimenez) - but for the most part due to problems with Lotito they've left the club.
Milanista
Mangiamoli!
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
But hasn't he taken the club to a healthier financial state? I remember the club was plagued with debt due to the Cragnotti era.
But hasn't he taken the club to a healthier financial state? I remember the club was plagued with debt due to the Cragnotti era.
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Lotito bought Lazio with recommendations and help from italian politicians, he spreaded the Y milion of debts in next X years and started buy players for cheap. First he bought the idol Di Canio for free, and then started buying good youngs for cheap (Kolarov, Zarate, Diakite, Muslera, Lichtsteiner, etc.) but also had LOTS of troubles with players: the first (if I'm not wrong) was Mutarelli, then Mudingayi, then Peruzzi, Bonetto, Degre, Artipoli, but also the homegrown De Silvestri and stars like Pandev and Ledesma.
This 2009/10 year was very bad: this summer he got rid of Ledesma, Pandev and De Silvestri because they asked a better contract, he refused their offers and offered them another contract but with less money. They refused and we all know what happened to them: De Silvestri fortunately went to Fiorentina, Pandev had to wait for a judge to solve his contract and go to shine with Inter, and Ledesma is still training with reserves (but rumors say he'll be back in first team, maybe).
Nowadays Lazio is similar to a dictatorship, if you try to argue with Mr.President you are out (Ballardini was something like a yes-man). And the players' mood is not good because of current charts.
The situation was similar to nowadays Roma's one: the owner has lot of debts but politicians and bankers protect the club.
Lotito bought Lazio with recommendations and help from italian politicians, he spreaded the Y milion of debts in next X years and started buy players for cheap. First he bought the idol Di Canio for free, and then started buying good youngs for cheap (Kolarov, Zarate, Diakite, Muslera, Lichtsteiner, etc.) but also had LOTS of troubles with players: the first (if I'm not wrong) was Mutarelli, then Mudingayi, then Peruzzi, Bonetto, Degre, Artipoli, but also the homegrown De Silvestri and stars like Pandev and Ledesma.
This 2009/10 year was very bad: this summer he got rid of Ledesma, Pandev and De Silvestri because they asked a better contract, he refused their offers and offered them another contract but with less money. They refused and we all know what happened to them: De Silvestri fortunately went to Fiorentina, Pandev had to wait for a judge to solve his contract and go to shine with Inter, and Ledesma is still training with reserves (but rumors say he'll be back in first team, maybe).
Nowadays Lazio is similar to a dictatorship, if you try to argue with Mr.President you are out (Ballardini was something like a yes-man). And the players' mood is not good because of current charts.
gerd
Retired Footballer
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Zarate has pubicly pleaded to take Ledesma in the team again...
Zarate has pubicly pleaded to take Ledesma in the team again...
lo zio
International
- 24 October 2005
- Palermo
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
he said that english and spanish leagues are nowadays way better than the italian, talking about facilities, security and the whole organization of the events. so everything except the football itself.
i'd say his point is pretty much undebeatable. as a matter of fact, if we don't consider the football, serie a is definitely not on par with premiership and la liga in pretty much every aspect (stadia attendance, the state of the facilities, the security policies and so on).
it all comes down to the fact that italian stadia aren't owned by the club themselves, but by the municipalities. that's serie a's biggest problem today.... and it's also the cause of our security issues and the cause of the very bad state of our facilities.
football clubs presidents don't really vibe on the idea of spending their own money to upgrade stadia that don't belong to the clubs themselves.... and the municipalities are tough negotiators...
it must be said though, that things seems to be on their way to change lately (palermo, udinese, fiorentina, juventus and a few other clubs i don't remember right now are working on their new stadia projects and those new stadia will be owned by the clubs themselves)...... but it's gonna take a lot of time for the whole league to reach the spanish and the british standards.
capello pretty much said that the only thing that labels serie a as a top league today is the football (wich means the quality of the players, of the coaches and the quality of the game itself)..... and honestly i completely agree with him.
------------------------------------------------------------
concerning lotito, i think the thruth is in the middle. yeah in the last few years he has made many mistakes...and he certainly isn't a great negotiatior.
concerning the ledesma\pandev case, i might agree with his basic idea in principle (as a matter of fact, players are getting way too much leverage today, when it comes to renegotiating contracts)....... but he certainly didn't look at the big picture. he should have never get himself involved in a batte he couldn't win from the very beginning.
but it must be said, as stefano pointed out, he's the one who saved lazio from bankrupt. he took charge of lazio's debts, settled a payment plan with the banks.... and even today he's still paying his predecessor's debts.
that was an unbelievable demonstration of passion and love for the club..... he could have easily let the club face bankrupt and then buy it on the cheap.... and with no debts at all..... but that would have meant letting lazio fall in serie c and he didn't want that to happen.
and when u think about what many football club presidents around europe are doing nowadays with their clubs, well i think lotito's actions command a certain respect.
sure most of the hardcore fans will regret the cragnotti era..... but honestly that doesn't make sense.....yeah cragnotti made lazio one of the greatests clubs in the world..... but he did that, not with his own money, with the banks money, and when it came the time to "ask for the check", he ran away.
lotito sure has his flaws..... but his pennywise strategy saved lazio from a very tragic death..... and let's also admit it.... he also made many good calls. he's the one who signed rossi and sabatini, and with sabatini and rossi he built a very good team without spending a fortune... yeah i know this season lazio is doing very bad, but we alll know that's mainly because of the dressing room troubles caused by the pandev\ledesma incident.
the team is much better than this... infact, squad-wise, lazio has nothing to envy to the likes of palermo and samp. next season, when this unpleasant situation will be over, they'll be back on track
edit:
i didn't read the capello interview before writing my post (i just based my post on a single line i heard on skysport)... so i checked up and it turns out he made the same point i did about the stadia ownership...... man, i'm good!
here it is
he said that english and spanish leagues are nowadays way better than the italian, talking about facilities, security and the whole organization of the events. so everything except the football itself.
i'd say his point is pretty much undebeatable. as a matter of fact, if we don't consider the football, serie a is definitely not on par with premiership and la liga in pretty much every aspect (stadia attendance, the state of the facilities, the security policies and so on).
it all comes down to the fact that italian stadia aren't owned by the club themselves, but by the municipalities. that's serie a's biggest problem today.... and it's also the cause of our security issues and the cause of the very bad state of our facilities.
football clubs presidents don't really vibe on the idea of spending their own money to upgrade stadia that don't belong to the clubs themselves.... and the municipalities are tough negotiators...
it must be said though, that things seems to be on their way to change lately (palermo, udinese, fiorentina, juventus and a few other clubs i don't remember right now are working on their new stadia projects and those new stadia will be owned by the clubs themselves)...... but it's gonna take a lot of time for the whole league to reach the spanish and the british standards.
capello pretty much said that the only thing that labels serie a as a top league today is the football (wich means the quality of the players, of the coaches and the quality of the game itself)..... and honestly i completely agree with him.
------------------------------------------------------------
concerning lotito, i think the thruth is in the middle. yeah in the last few years he has made many mistakes...and he certainly isn't a great negotiatior.
concerning the ledesma\pandev case, i might agree with his basic idea in principle (as a matter of fact, players are getting way too much leverage today, when it comes to renegotiating contracts)....... but he certainly didn't look at the big picture. he should have never get himself involved in a batte he couldn't win from the very beginning.
but it must be said, as stefano pointed out, he's the one who saved lazio from bankrupt. he took charge of lazio's debts, settled a payment plan with the banks.... and even today he's still paying his predecessor's debts.
that was an unbelievable demonstration of passion and love for the club..... he could have easily let the club face bankrupt and then buy it on the cheap.... and with no debts at all..... but that would have meant letting lazio fall in serie c and he didn't want that to happen.
and when u think about what many football club presidents around europe are doing nowadays with their clubs, well i think lotito's actions command a certain respect.
sure most of the hardcore fans will regret the cragnotti era..... but honestly that doesn't make sense.....yeah cragnotti made lazio one of the greatests clubs in the world..... but he did that, not with his own money, with the banks money, and when it came the time to "ask for the check", he ran away.
lotito sure has his flaws..... but his pennywise strategy saved lazio from a very tragic death..... and let's also admit it.... he also made many good calls. he's the one who signed rossi and sabatini, and with sabatini and rossi he built a very good team without spending a fortune... yeah i know this season lazio is doing very bad, but we alll know that's mainly because of the dressing room troubles caused by the pandev\ledesma incident.
the team is much better than this... infact, squad-wise, lazio has nothing to envy to the likes of palermo and samp. next season, when this unpleasant situation will be over, they'll be back on track
edit:
i didn't read the capello interview before writing my post (i just based my post on a single line i heard on skysport)... so i checked up and it turns out he made the same point i did about the stadia ownership...... man, i'm good!
here it is
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lo zio
International
- 24 October 2005
- Palermo
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
really? i thought mezzaroma was way younger than lotito
oh and btw, one thing i forgot to say the other day about lazio's situation: do not question ballardini guys. the man is a genious!
anyhow it looks like i missed a heck of a game yesterday (i watched the highlights of milan udinese)... ronaldinho was on fire! apparently berlusconi's reprimand worked like a charm. nice to see nesta and pato back on the pitch aswell (although, from what i heard on tv, they're still far from fit)..... and how come borriello didn't play?
really? i thought mezzaroma was way younger than lotito
oh and btw, one thing i forgot to say the other day about lazio's situation: do not question ballardini guys. the man is a genious!
anyhow it looks like i missed a heck of a game yesterday (i watched the highlights of milan udinese)... ronaldinho was on fire! apparently berlusconi's reprimand worked like a charm. nice to see nesta and pato back on the pitch aswell (although, from what i heard on tv, they're still far from fit)..... and how come borriello didn't play?
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
The fact is Siena was bought from Mezzaroma Group (a.k.a. Mezzaroma Mafia) that's why I wrote "owner" instead of "president".
I made a little research and found this: Lotito is married with Cristina Mezzaroma, son of Roberto Mezzaroma. Roberto's brother is Pietro and Pietro's son is Massimo (the official Siena president, who is also owner of M. Roma Volley, you can easily understand what M. means). So Lotito's wife is Siena president's cousin. I believe the article where I read about father-in-law was wrong, or was talking about Group, who knows..
The only true fact is this can be a conflict of interest (not to mention that Mezzaromas have also quotes in Roma and Lazio)
The fact is Siena was bought from Mezzaroma Group (a.k.a. Mezzaroma Mafia) that's why I wrote "owner" instead of "president".
I made a little research and found this: Lotito is married with Cristina Mezzaroma, son of Roberto Mezzaroma. Roberto's brother is Pietro and Pietro's son is Massimo (the official Siena president, who is also owner of M. Roma Volley, you can easily understand what M. means). So Lotito's wife is Siena president's cousin. I believe the article where I read about father-in-law was wrong, or was talking about Group, who knows..
The only true fact is this can be a conflict of interest (not to mention that Mezzaromas have also quotes in Roma and Lazio)
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
And what the hell with Palermo... Are they messing up on purpose. Zamparini's post match comments did crack me up tho...
tell that to lazio fans
It's clear Milan really missed Pato's pace and ability to break through the defensive line. I thought Borriello was injured but Huntelaar scored 2 (could've been 3) so I'm sure Milan fan's don't care. I reckon he'll get more opportunities in the starting lineup, he's a better goal poacher, but Borriello has more presence in the pk area and is better at holding up the ball.
And what the hell with Palermo... Are they messing up on purpose. Zamparini's post match comments did crack me up tho...
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cfdh_edmundo
Maverick
- 30 December 2002
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
This is ridiculous, Juventus just cheat and cheat again, just like the Lazio match last month Del Piero cheats for another penalty. No wonder they are useless in Europe, their whole league position is a sham, under normal circumstances they are no where near the 4th or even 6th best team in Italy, hopefully Ajax can smash them at in a few days time.
This is ridiculous, Juventus just cheat and cheat again, just like the Lazio match last month Del Piero cheats for another penalty. No wonder they are useless in Europe, their whole league position is a sham, under normal circumstances they are no where near the 4th or even 6th best team in Italy, hopefully Ajax can smash them at in a few days time.
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
According to Del Piero:
FIrst off it was outside the area and secondly he tripped over himself Clearly Jugay can't get too far without cheating 
Ajax will sort them out, I'm sure of it.
Any one know what happened in the stands? Fire? Fireworks?
According to Del Piero:
FIrst off it was outside the area and secondly he tripped over himself
Clearly Jugay can't get too far without cheating Ajax will sort them out, I'm sure of it. Any one know what happened in the stands? Fire? Fireworks?
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
yeah yeah ok the referees just gave some free points in the last matches, but so you do mean that in all the previous ones they were always plain and fair? always giving good calls? come on... two invented penalties and it's a conspiracy, what about Inter then? I'm not saying the referees are ordered from above, neither for Inter. But if you insist that this is the case, then consider the whole season please... :|
yeah yeah ok the referees just gave some free points in the last matches, but so you do mean that in all the previous ones they were always plain and fair? always giving good calls? come on... two invented penalties and it's a conspiracy, what about Inter then? I'm not saying the referees are ordered from above, neither for Inter. But if you insist that this is the case, then consider the whole season please... :|
Aboutreika18
Too Black, Too Strong
- 5 September 2006
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Hehe, the irony in Inter fans complaining about poor penalty decisions when they've benefitted from some in recent memory, not least from Balotelli's diving.
Nice to see Roma in great form, nine wins in a row!
Hehe, the irony in Inter fans complaining about poor penalty decisions when they've benefitted from some in recent memory, not least from Balotelli's diving.
Nice to see Roma in great form, nine wins in a row!
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Wasn't complaining about the ref, he could've done worse and given a red card for last man... just if I was a jugay fan I would hate to win this way... if i was a Genoa fan I would be livid... if I was Del Perio I would be ashamed. Referees will make mistakes in high pressure situations i.e. each and every serie a match, they only have 1 second window to make a decision and sometimes they bow to the pressure. But this was taking the piss... Imagine, for second, if it was Balotelli and not Del Piero. You guys would probably lose your minds
Yeah like today versus Napoli or the time Sneijder got a straight red for clapping at the ref
Wasn't complaining about the ref, he could've done worse and given a red card for last man... just if I was a jugay fan I would hate to win this way... if i was a Genoa fan I would be livid... if I was Del Perio I would be ashamed. Referees will make mistakes in high pressure situations i.e. each and every serie a match, they only have 1 second window to make a decision and sometimes they bow to the pressure. But this was taking the piss... Imagine, for second, if it was Balotelli and not Del Piero. You guys would probably lose your minds
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gerd
Retired Footballer
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Yes, sadly this is football...if even a gentleman like Del Piero acts like this.
What is happening to Atalanta. It looks as if they won't make and will go down. What is wrong? Is the team not good enough. If, i'm not mistaken they lost a couple of very good players over the last years and is Doni becoming too old?
Yes, sadly this is football...if even a gentleman like Del Piero acts like this.
What is happening to Atalanta. It looks as if they won't make and will go down. What is wrong? Is the team not good enough. If, i'm not mistaken they lost a couple of very good players over the last years and is Doni becoming too old?
matt1288
B4MF
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Some of the posts in here are a complete joke, saying Del Piero should be ashamed. As far as I'm aware he tripped on the ball and fell down, the referee gave the penalty and there were no or hardly any protests from Juventus players. The referee made a mistake, just like it has happened many times in all leagues over Europe, deal with it. Don't start accusing Del Piero and so forth, because it is really uncalled for.
But Gerd is right, this is football and things like this happen. But you cannot blame Del Piero for this.
Some of the posts in here are a complete joke, saying Del Piero should be ashamed. As far as I'm aware he tripped on the ball and fell down, the referee gave the penalty and there were no or hardly any protests from Juventus players. The referee made a mistake, just like it has happened many times in all leagues over Europe, deal with it. Don't start accusing Del Piero and so forth, because it is really uncalled for.
But Gerd is right, this is football and things like this happen. But you cannot blame Del Piero for this.
cfdh_edmundo
Maverick
- 30 December 2002
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
It's the second time in the space of 4 weeks that he's done this. As "Leo Messi" said, it's like they are being pushed into 4th place, which is a disgrace. It looks like Inter, Roma and Milan will be there on merit, but the next team (which should be, on merit, Napoli, Samp, or even Palermo) will be edged out by a corrupt Juventus. It's like calciopoli scandal never happened. All this rubbish about it "being part of the modern game" I dont buy that at all, it should be stamped out and Del Piero should get a ban.
It's the second time in the space of 4 weeks that he's done this. As "Leo Messi" said, it's like they are being pushed into 4th place, which is a disgrace. It looks like Inter, Roma and Milan will be there on merit, but the next team (which should be, on merit, Napoli, Samp, or even Palermo) will be edged out by a corrupt Juventus. It's like calciopoli scandal never happened. All this rubbish about it "being part of the modern game" I dont buy that at all, it should be stamped out and Del Piero should get a ban.
matt1288
B4MF
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Del Piero should get a ban for tripping on his own feet and getting a penalty? Tell me what did he do wrong last night?
Del Piero should get a ban for tripping on his own feet and getting a penalty? Tell me what did he do wrong last night?
lo zio
International
- 24 October 2005
- Palermo
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
come on guys let's be sensible... that was a dive. no arguments about that. alex shouldn't have done that and the penalty shouldn't have been given... but that's it.
as dafrenz pointed out, we can't scream conspiracy every time a top club gets away with a questionable call from the ref.... refs are humans and make mistakes, like anyone else..... and italian refs make the same mistakes spanish and english do..... yet i don't see spanish and english fans questioning the whole tournament for a wrong call.
some might say they didn't face a scandal like calciopoli.....and that's true, but jeez guys, serie a moved on..... and so should we!
none of the people involved in that scandal is still here.... lanese (former italian ref's association presindent)? burned. pairetto and bergano (those 2 corrupted bastards who used to "select" the refs for the matches)? burned. carraro (former federcalcio president)? burned. moggi and giraudo? fired and banned from the federation. the refs personally involved in the fixed matches? all burned and banned...
they're all gone. now we have a new federcalcio president (abete), a new generation of referees (who are acutally getting better and better every season), a new "referees boss", collina, who is a man whose morality is unquestionable.
serie a has changed. so let's just stop looking for "masters of puppets" everywhere and let's face the unquestionable truth: ref's mistakes are part of the game (i wouldn't say the same about diving though, and i certainly wouldn't say alessandro is not to blame).
no one is trying to push juventus to the 4th place....palermo too is a contender for the 4th place.... and palermo too was given a non existant penalty saturday against roma (there was a foul on pastore, but it was clearely outside the box)....so what? is someone trying to push palermo too?! well if that's the case i guess this master of puppets should make up his mind.... who's got to get that 4th place? palermo or juve....coz "helping" 2 contenders to get the same prize isn't really a smart call.
what's really disturbing in this situation is del piero's act though. this is his second diving in just a few weeks..... now i can understand how frustrating it must be to face such a bad period, and i also can understand a normal player would get to the point to do anything to get his team the 3 points, even diving.
but alessandro is not a normal player....... that's just not him. so i really hope alessandro will realise that and be back to his real self as soon as possible...... because it takes just a few months of bad attitude to destroy the great fair player reputation he built for himself over an entire carreer.
and i also have to say rfu is probably right. if balotelli would have done the same, he would have got much more stick than that.
long story short...
refs always make mistakes and this shouldn't really raise any eyebrows.
del piero dived, that's pretty much unquestionable. and he should be punished for that. the fact that this is not something he's used to doesn't mean he can get away with it when he dives.
and for god sake no one is trying to help juve to reach the 4th place. the truth is u guys tend to notice only the questionable calls refs make during the top clubs matches and this alters your perception....... infact i'm pretty sure most of u didn't notice that non existent penalty palermo was given sathurday.
on one side we have delio rossi. right until last season he was considered as one of the best coaches in serie a. he did an amazing job at lazio, built a fantastic team and had it playing some very beautiful football..... and he did exactly the same at lecce, before signing for lazio. then half way through last season, something happened, and lazio couldn't deliver anymore (funnily lazio's downfall begun right when the pandev\ledesma incident broke up..... u think that's a coincidence?).
people blamed rossi for lazio's bad results (as if a good manager could all of a sudden turn into a poor manager), and rossi left the job. he signed for palermo, and voilà, the good old rossi is back. palermo is delivering and we're also playing some pretty good football..... as soon as he left lazio, rossi suddenly turned back to his previous standards......
on the other side there is ballardini. a coach who has been labelled from Sacchi as one of the most promising coaches of this new generation. he has done an outstanding job in cagliari (to be fair, half of the credit for this current nice allegri's cagliari should go to ballardini). then he moved to palermo and in 2 months he had us playing the best football i have ever seen palermo playing in my life...... if only he would have done what he did in cagliari and palermo for a more "glamourous" club (say, genoa, fiorentina or napoli) he would have been considered almost on the same standards of the likes of blanc, gasperini and prandelli right now.
this summer he moved to lazio and, just like rossi before him, all of a sudden, he becomes a "poor manager".....
honestly i'd say it's pretty obvious that lazio's problems have nothing to do with the coaching guidance. don't u think?
come on guys let's be sensible... that was a dive. no arguments about that. alex shouldn't have done that and the penalty shouldn't have been given... but that's it.
as dafrenz pointed out, we can't scream conspiracy every time a top club gets away with a questionable call from the ref.... refs are humans and make mistakes, like anyone else..... and italian refs make the same mistakes spanish and english do..... yet i don't see spanish and english fans questioning the whole tournament for a wrong call.
some might say they didn't face a scandal like calciopoli.....and that's true, but jeez guys, serie a moved on..... and so should we!
none of the people involved in that scandal is still here.... lanese (former italian ref's association presindent)? burned. pairetto and bergano (those 2 corrupted bastards who used to "select" the refs for the matches)? burned. carraro (former federcalcio president)? burned. moggi and giraudo? fired and banned from the federation. the refs personally involved in the fixed matches? all burned and banned...
they're all gone. now we have a new federcalcio president (abete), a new generation of referees (who are acutally getting better and better every season), a new "referees boss", collina, who is a man whose morality is unquestionable.
serie a has changed. so let's just stop looking for "masters of puppets" everywhere and let's face the unquestionable truth: ref's mistakes are part of the game (i wouldn't say the same about diving though, and i certainly wouldn't say alessandro is not to blame).
no one is trying to push juventus to the 4th place....palermo too is a contender for the 4th place.... and palermo too was given a non existant penalty saturday against roma (there was a foul on pastore, but it was clearely outside the box)....so what? is someone trying to push palermo too?! well if that's the case i guess this master of puppets should make up his mind.... who's got to get that 4th place? palermo or juve....coz "helping" 2 contenders to get the same prize isn't really a smart call.
what's really disturbing in this situation is del piero's act though. this is his second diving in just a few weeks..... now i can understand how frustrating it must be to face such a bad period, and i also can understand a normal player would get to the point to do anything to get his team the 3 points, even diving.
but alessandro is not a normal player....... that's just not him. so i really hope alessandro will realise that and be back to his real self as soon as possible...... because it takes just a few months of bad attitude to destroy the great fair player reputation he built for himself over an entire carreer.
and i also have to say rfu is probably right. if balotelli would have done the same, he would have got much more stick than that.
long story short...
refs always make mistakes and this shouldn't really raise any eyebrows.
del piero dived, that's pretty much unquestionable. and he should be punished for that. the fact that this is not something he's used to doesn't mean he can get away with it when he dives.
and for god sake no one is trying to help juve to reach the 4th place. the truth is u guys tend to notice only the questionable calls refs make during the top clubs matches and this alters your perception....... infact i'm pretty sure most of u didn't notice that non existent penalty palermo was given sathurday.
well let me put it like this.rfu said:
on one side we have delio rossi. right until last season he was considered as one of the best coaches in serie a. he did an amazing job at lazio, built a fantastic team and had it playing some very beautiful football..... and he did exactly the same at lecce, before signing for lazio. then half way through last season, something happened, and lazio couldn't deliver anymore (funnily lazio's downfall begun right when the pandev\ledesma incident broke up..... u think that's a coincidence?).
people blamed rossi for lazio's bad results (as if a good manager could all of a sudden turn into a poor manager), and rossi left the job. he signed for palermo, and voilà, the good old rossi is back. palermo is delivering and we're also playing some pretty good football..... as soon as he left lazio, rossi suddenly turned back to his previous standards......
on the other side there is ballardini. a coach who has been labelled from Sacchi as one of the most promising coaches of this new generation. he has done an outstanding job in cagliari (to be fair, half of the credit for this current nice allegri's cagliari should go to ballardini). then he moved to palermo and in 2 months he had us playing the best football i have ever seen palermo playing in my life...... if only he would have done what he did in cagliari and palermo for a more "glamourous" club (say, genoa, fiorentina or napoli) he would have been considered almost on the same standards of the likes of blanc, gasperini and prandelli right now.
this summer he moved to lazio and, just like rossi before him, all of a sudden, he becomes a "poor manager".....
honestly i'd say it's pretty obvious that lazio's problems have nothing to do with the coaching guidance. don't u think?
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Barreto (who he was expected to be the best midfielder of the lot) missed most of the season so far for an injury.. Acquafresca has been injured and he never really hit the top form (he's been sold at the end).. Ferreira Pinto did the same.. Costinha never saw the pitch or something similar (well, they already knew Costinha was on a long-term injury to be honest >
)..
In my opinion Atalanta have some good players like Valdes or Garics or even Tiribocchi.. That's why I think they'll manage to avoid relegation eventually
Indeed Doni can't handle everything on his shoulders anymore.. But I don't think that Atalanta have a bad squad, they've just been unlucky!!
Barreto (who he was expected to be the best midfielder of the lot) missed most of the season so far for an injury.. Acquafresca has been injured and he never really hit the top form (he's been sold at the end).. Ferreira Pinto did the same.. Costinha never saw the pitch or something similar (well, they already knew Costinha was on a long-term injury to be honest >
)..In my opinion Atalanta have some good players like Valdes or Garics or even Tiribocchi.. That's why I think they'll manage to avoid relegation eventually
Aboutreika18
Too Black, Too Strong
- 5 September 2006
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
It's true that because of Del Piero's reputation, he won't get the same backlash that Balotelli would, although obviously Balotelli's a very easy person to hate and criticise due to his immaturity and negative demeanor compared to Del Piero, not that it should matter in this case.
I was just playing devil's advocate anyway.Yeah like today versus Napoli or the time Sneijder got a straight red for clapping at the ref
It's true that because of Del Piero's reputation, he won't get the same backlash that Balotelli would, although obviously Balotelli's a very easy person to hate and criticise due to his immaturity and negative demeanor compared to Del Piero, not that it should matter in this case.
gerd
Retired Footballer
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
Lots of complot theories around Italian football.
I think FIFA or UEFA should do something against unfair behaviour. Problem is that you just can't start somewhere. It should be done at the start of the competition. People who dive should get punished. People who dive repeatedly should get worse punishments.
Players who influence referees: punishments
Coaches who try to influence referees: idem ditto.
FA's should have the courage to use footage of matches to take measures post factum. After one or two seasons it should be better.
Lots of complot theories around Italian football.
I think FIFA or UEFA should do something against unfair behaviour. Problem is that you just can't start somewhere. It should be done at the start of the competition. People who dive should get punished. People who dive repeatedly should get worse punishments.
Players who influence referees: punishments
Coaches who try to influence referees: idem ditto.
FA's should have the courage to use footage of matches to take measures post factum. After one or two seasons it should be better.
Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season
He should have been shown a yellow (and I say it against my interest, seeing that I have Totti in the starting eleven of my fantasy league team), he shouldn't be allowed to do whatever he wants!!
The problem is NOT why Sneijder has been sent off, but why Totti and other people doing the same NEVER get shown a red!!
That's something Totti should read: saturday he repeatedly shouted at the referee "it's a corner, it's a corner, it's a corner" when, after a deflected shot, the referee just awarded Palermo a goal kick.
He should have been shown a yellow (and I say it against my interest, seeing that I have Totti in the starting eleven of my fantasy league team), he shouldn't be allowed to do whatever he wants!!
Like it should have been, it happened also to Lucarelli and no-one made a case out of it.or the time Sneijder got a straight red for clapping at the ref
The problem is NOT why Sneijder has been sent off, but why Totti and other people doing the same NEVER get shown a red!!