Serie A Thread - 2014/15 Season

[lo zio]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Ben, your avatar is awesome!

brand new bauta mask my girl bought for me.
https://www.socaldesignco.com/cart/product.php?productid=16314&js=n
she said she thought it would have been a slick way to have me getting 2 tickets for venezia this week end.... and it worked
the bauta is quite a creepy caracther.... but boy, the dress and the mask are so cool i just can't wait till this week end.
God i love carnevale.... it's the only time in the year when i wish i was single

 

[gerd]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Ben if you say that Milan disappointed because the way Fiorentina played, well then i must agree with you. Perhaps i shouldn't think that i'n tactically astute because i won a scudetto with Palermo in Football Manager...

 

[lo zio]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Ben if you say that Milan disappointed because the way Fiorentina played, well then i must agree with you.

i assume u meant to say bayern? well yes.. not exclusively, of course, but sure part of the credit for bayern performance goes to fiorentina.
u see, my only point is, they went in germany with a pretty solid plan, and they did (very well) what they were supposed to do.

they weren't supposed to go to the allianz arena and impose their own plot to the game... they weren't able to do it with weaker teams like cagliari or palermo in the past few weeks, let alone bayern munich.

even when top class clubs face each others in champions league, the away team doesn't usually bother to force his plot... most of them usually settle down and look for a chance to hit (manchester utd does it pretty often)... european fixtures are tricky. teams and coaches don't know each others as well as teams which plays in the same league. therefore they are much more careful in away fixtures.
mind u, careful doesn't mean defensive.... fiorentina had 6 shots on goal yesterday... just 2 less than bayern, and they did look much more dangerous than bayern aswell.

and btw what i just said refers to top class clubs... clubs which belong to the same level. now, fiorentina is a fantastic team, their football is entertaining and their players are skilled...... but, as entertaining and skilled as they are, they are not a top class club (maybe just not yet, who knows).

so if we can't expect man utd to go in milano and force milan to play "their game", how can we expect a team like fiorentina to go in munich and impose its plot to bayern?

and that assuming fiorentina was in a good form..... but we know fiorentina has never been in such a bad form as in the last 2 months.... and we know they played almost the entire match with 1 man less.
if u take into account all that then u'll see yesterday's match for what it was: not a scared defensive approach, but a brave display of personality from a young, unexperienced but very good team.

besides u also have to consider one last thing. this european campaign is already a success for fiorentina. according to their "step by step" program, they already went further than last year, so they already accomplished their european mission.... now they will have to focus on the campionato (as right now their partecipation to the next champions league is seriously in doubt, given the competition).
for bayern instead, this isn't a success already. getting out of the champions league at this stage would be seen as a failure for bayern munich (wich once again says about the gap between theese 2 teams). so the "motivation-factor" is all in their favour.

and finally, let's not forget that, if it wasn't for that offside goal, the game would have ended 1-1..... and probably right now everyone in europe would be praising fiorentina and cesare prandelli for such a great result.
long story short... as matthew the evangelist wrote, give to Caesar what is Caesar's .... u're not going to question an apostle, are u?

edit:
stefano, i still didn't read a thing from u about milan's match. wich are your thoughts about the game and your feelings about the 2nd leg?

 

[gerd]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Thanks Ben...and sorry for my mistakes about this match...premature Alzheimer ?

 

[Milanista]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Ben, I was at a birthday party so I missed the game. But to be honest, I was quite pessimistic before the game, and didn't really expect us to win. I saw the goals, and the 2nd and 3rd were all terrible defensive errors... but its unfair for me to criticize those players because I didn't see their overall performances.

I heard that Antonini and Bonera were impressive for most of the game... which is nice because I always thought they were solid players.

What I can comment on is Berlusconi.... he is being a complete idiot. First the Mancini comments, now hes basically saying the team is 'competitive' enough to win stuff and is implying that Leonardo is doing it wrong. For me, Leonardo is doing the best he can with a mediocre squad. I think we need 4 important signings: a reliable long term GK, a physical and quick full back, an ambitious midfield and a center back that can replace or cover Nesta.

We keep showing signs of fatigue and lack of depth. Teams like Inter, Roma, Fiorentina and Juve have far greater depth than us.

 

[Aboutreika18]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Why is Dida preferred to Abbiati in your goal?

 

[Milanista]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Abbiati just got back from a long term injury, so he's unfit still. Dida has also been random - an impressive performance.....then a major fuck up... then important performance....

 

[Aboutreika18]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

What happened to Dida anyway?

Usually top class keepers tend to still be good performers at an old age, look at van der Sar.

I'd have an unfit Abbiati over the current Dida at the present time but it makes sense not to rush him back.

 

[Neoexodus]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Dida as the Handling of a 1 year old. Unbelievable..

 

[lo zio]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

What happened to Dida anyway?

Usually top class keepers tend to still be good performers at an old age, look at van der Sar.

.... wich is why dida should have never been considered a top class keeper

Thanks Ben...and sorry for my mistakes about this match...premature Alzheimer ?

gerd, sorry about what? we're just sharing our opinions. and by very definition, an opinion can't be right or wrong. my view on the match is just as valuable as yours, and u certainly shouldn't consider your view as a "mistake" just coz i have a different one.
seriously guys, quite often i feel many of u hugely overestimate my understanding of the game.
i just wanted to explain my point. u might agree or not on it, but certainly u shouldn't apologise for disagreeing. besides a disagreement is essential for a stimulating conversation....
actually by reading your post, i feel i'm the one who should apologise

What I can comment on is Berlusconi.... he is being a complete idiot. First the Mancini comments, now hes basically saying the team is 'competitive' enough to win stuff and is implying that Leonardo is doing it wrong. For me, Leonardo is doing the best he can with a mediocre squad. I think we need 4 important signings: a reliable long term GK, a physical and quick full back, an ambitious midfield and a center back that can replace or cover Nesta.

no arguments about that bro!

 

[Zeem]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

What I can comment on is Berlusconi.... he is being a complete idiot. First the Mancini comments, now hes basically saying the team is 'competitive' enough to win stuff and is implying that Leonardo is doing it wrong. For me, Leonardo is doing the best he can with a mediocre squad. I think we need 4 important signings: a reliable long term GK, a physical and quick full back, an ambitious midfield and a center back that can replace or cover Nesta.

Not expecting much this summer again. I mean despite strucking a 60 mill(I think it is even more since Milan are going to be maybe the best team they have) deal with Fly Emirates and the sale of Kaka, Galliani is still saying the condition in Italy doesn't allow him to buy and he is looking for free players.

Other thing, just read that Mutu's agent said that if Milan were able to sell Huntelaar in January, Mutu would have joined Milan . Good thing that didn't happen.

 

[rfU]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Other thing, just read that Mutu's agent said that if Milan were able to sell Huntelaar in January, Mutu would have joined Milan . Good thing that didn't happen.

yeah. I can't decide if he's unlucky or just stupid. Regardless, he remains a fantastic player, one wonders how things would have turned out for him if he (and perhaps Frey) had remained at Inter.

About Milan, they were the better side for long stretches, but tactically Fergie messed up. Had he fielded Fletcher and Anderson centrally to pick at Pirlo and Beckham, Man U would have dominated the game. Carrick and Scholes had no chance, they're too slow and lacking physically. But since when does possession and good football win you games

And Dida is godawful. Generally speaking he had 1 world class season and world cup. And Abbiati's handling is only marginally better. Milan certainly deserve better.

As for the 2nd leg, Milan have no chance which is a shame because ManU are nowhere as good as last season. It's unfathomable that Rio Ferdinand is the highest paid defender in the world. That said Nesta was far more calamitous, letting Rooney "ghost" by like that for the third goal... ridiculous

Man, really looking forward to next weeks clash versus Chelsea. Ancelotti has his distractions, with the recent loss to Everton, ManU and Arsenal only a few points away, and Essien and Cole out injured for several weeks, we on the other hand have a significant lead in serie A and for once, an injury free squad. A little worried about Drogba, and Malouda is fine form but Zanetti has dealt with better. The Chelsea midfield are rather physical, so a little worried for Sneijder.

 

[Aboutreika18]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

yeah. I can't decide if he's unlucky or just stupid. Regardless, he remains a fantastic player, one wonders how things would have turned out for him if he (and perhaps Frey) had remained at Inter.

About Milan, they were the better side for long stretches, but tactically Fergie messed up. Had he fielded Fletcher and Anderson centrally to pick at Pirlo and Beckham, Man U would have dominated the game. Carrick and Scholes had no chance, they're too slow and lacking physically. But since when does possession and good football win you games

And Dida is godawful. Generally speaking he had 1 world class season and world cup. And Abbiati's handling is only marginally better. Milan certainly deserve better.

As for the 2nd leg, Milan have no chance which is a shame because ManU are nowhere as good as last season. It's unfathomable that Rio Ferdinand is the highest paid defender in the world. That said Nesta was far more calamitous, letting Rooney "ghost" by like that for the third goal... ridiculous

Fergie was spot on tactically. Moving Park into the centre to harry Pirlo and deny him space and time on the ball and Fletcher set up two goals from that position on the left, as well as helping Evra deal with Pato.

Defensively, we were all over the shop though. Ferdinand and Evans don't really click together as a partnership as they're both ball-playing defenders and neither have the aerial prowess that a Vidic or Brown has. Evans in particular was very poor, strange given how excellent he was last season in the same stadium against stronger opposition, so van der Sar had to be at his best.

"Nowhere near as good as last season" is a ridiculous statement. We might have lost Ronaldo but Rooney's goal output as increased immensely as well as the goal output from the midfield to make up for that. We've also played much better football this season without having Ronaldo as the focal point of our team.

And since when has Ferdinand been the highest paid defender in the world? Everyone knows it's John Terry, especially after signing a contract that made him the highest paid player in the Premier League last summer. If that was a dig at Ferdinand then you need to take in account the injury problems he's suffered this season. That was only his 10th start of the season for us!

 

[Jumbo_]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Ferdinand isn't the highest paid defender in the world, and he's hardly played for months so it's no wonder he was a bit rusty.

EDIT: Abou beat me to it and added some more very valid points.

 

[rfU]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Fergie was spot on tactically. Moving Park into the centre to harry Pirlo and deny him space and time on the ball

True but what ended up happening? Milan dominated possession, throughout. How is that possible when they had an incredibly slow midfield trio versus your (I assume you're a ManU fan) 5-man midfield? But would that guarantee you the win? Who knows. At the end of it all, possession equates to nothing.

Evans in particular was very poor, strange given how excellent he was last season in the same stadium against stronger opposition

Ah well said

"Nowhere near as good as last season" is a ridiculous statement. We might have lost Ronaldo but Rooney's goal output as increased immensely as well as the goal output from the midfield to make up for that.

Wasn't aware that the midfield was in such fine goal scoring form, and as you stated Rooney has quite admirably taken on the burden left to him by CR7. But who else has performed better this season? Certainly not Vidic? Has Evra? Park? Berbabitch? Carrick? Anderson .... Clearly Scholes and Giggs are way best their best, luckily for Ferguson that still leaves them head and shoulders above most premiership mids. Only Fletcher and Rooney have come through this season, from what I've seen anyway. You have to agree that the ManU of last season was a stronger team? Surely?

And since when has Ferdinand been the highest paid defender in the world? Everyone knows it's John Terry

Whoops, my bad.

 

[gerd]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Ben, you don't need to apologize.
I wznted to apologize because i was on my high horse about tacttics and didn't even know that a defender was an attacker...in retrospect it is rather ridiculous to give a tactical master class and not even knowing that Natale (or Di Natale, now i will mix up these players for as long as they play) or whatever his name is, was not an attacker but a defender...it also proves that i didn't watch the match with big attention...i should have kept quiet...hence it's logical to apologize.

 

[lo zio]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Gerd this thread is just about chatting over italian football topics. it's not a place to showcase your knowledge. besides there is no one in here that can call himself a football expert (except Sina, probably), so if we should just keep quite coz we're not sure wheter what we're about to write is right or wrong... then none of us should ever write a post.
it's just some fun football chatting, nothing more than that. it's a chance to improve our knowledge over certain topics (and for those like me who are not native english speaker is also a chance to practice our english).
so please, don't ever apologise for your opinions and don't "keep quiet".... it makes me feel like a silly arrogant "football expert"...... i'm probably silly and arrogant, but sure i'm no football expert

rfu, that's a bit off topic, but i really wouldn't say man utd is nowhere near as good as last season. actually if there's one thing man utd proved this season, is that they were much more than just a one man team. it's the backbone (ferdinand-vidic-fletcher-carrick-rooney) what makes this team awesome..... and they proved they're actually so good that, not only they can't do without ronaldo, but they can also cope with the absence of those key players who form the spine of the team (like ferdinand, vidic, and carrick).

also the argument "did evra or carrick or park stepped up?" isn't a valid one. ronaldo's presence alone used to attract lots of attention and "care" from the opponents.... and that gave other players like evra and carrick much more freedom. this season they don't have this freedom anymore and have to carry a much more serious "burden"..... and i'd say so far they've handled this new situation very well.

i'm not saying that ronaldo wasn't a key asset, of course. what i'm saying is that ronaldo wasn't part of the team's spine and that they coped with his absence very well (at least till now).

 

[*aLe]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

it makes me feel like a silly arrogant "football expert"...... i'm probably silly and arrogant, but sure i'm no football expert

This made my day

On a different note, zio, your understanding of the game is way bigger than the one of the people I usually talk about football with so, in my opinion, you fully deserve the "football expert" title

No, wait.. There's no way a "football expert" can support Palermo for real.. Ok, you're right: you're no football expert

 

[lo zio]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

On a different note, zio, your understanding of the game is way bigger than the one of the people I usually talk about football with

yeah, but that's probably because the people u usually chat about football with are atalanta supporters
i guess now we're even

 

[gerd]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

I've got two favourite teams in Italy: Atalanta and Palermo...

About ManUtd: i think Valencia is somewhat underestimated. I think he does splendid. Of course he's not the supertalent that Ronaldo is, but i think he's very good. An excellent crosser.I'm far from a big fan of Ferguson, but you got to hand it to him: another excellent buy from a "litle" team...Man Utd can be succesfull witout the "real stars".

Players like Giggs, Scholes and Rooney are (or were) among the best in the world, but they are no stars. Up to a certain degree this was also the case for Cantona and even more for Schmeichel (the second best player ever to play for Man Utd and somewhat underestimated because he was GK).

 

[Milanista]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Apparently Inter have signed Ranocchia who will arrive in June

 

[Leo Bax]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Apparently Inter have signed Ranocchia who will arrive in June

Some months ago I predicted Bonucci to Inter because he was from Inter youth system and because Moratti & Preziosi are business friends; it seems I choose the wrong defender...
.....or maybe Inter will buy both?! ...

Honestly I don't know where he will play, of course not instead of Samuel so I think Lucio will loose his place. In this case he will go away for sure to play as starter somewhere. If this rumor is right, I think Inter will enter in history: the last time they bought an italian was ages ago! (was it Grosso in 2006, am I right?)

BTW, Preziosi is making something good for him: he got Moratti's money selling him Milito and Motta, and he invested that money on youngs like Bonucci, Meggiorini, Fatic, Acquafresca (all from Inter youth system), Ranocchia or the last one Aleksic. The funny thing is that Moratti is capable of sell these youngs to him for cheap, and re-buy them for 10-15 milions (he will probably do the same with Parma for Biabiany in future, who knows), something like Real Madrid did for Granero, Negredo, and other hot prospect. I don't like this system, I always prefer a simple loan.

 

[Milanista]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

I think Inter signed him to use as a tool to sign other players.

 

[rfU]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Honestly I don't know where he will play, of course not instead of Samuel so I think Lucio will loose his place. In this case he will go away for sure to play as starter somewhere.

I think what will happen is that he will go on loan to Genoa next season but still be an Inter player. Also one of our youth out of Krhin, Obi, Destro, and maybe Stevanovic will go to Genoa on a co-ownership. So complicated.

 

[Milanista]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

I think Inter's reds were fair.

 

[rfU]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

I think Inter's reds were fair.

course you do, but you're wrong. When you see the Cordoba second yellow from a reverse angle, there wasn't much contact with Pozzi. But in a heated game like that I can see why the ref would react the way he did. But he was wrong. Strangely enough, we played better 2 men down Clearly we're not a possession team.

 

[DeFrenZ]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

Well Cordoba's second yellow wasn't so wrong, though. It's an hard foul, which depending on the referee could be given or not

 

[Milanista]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

course you do, but you're wrong. When you see the Cordoba second yellow from a reverse angle, there wasn't much contact with Pozzi. But in a heated game like that I can see why the ref would react the way he did. But he was wrong. Strangely enough, we played better 2 men down Clearly we're not a possession team.

I think most Italian referees would have given that 2nd yellow, regardless of who committed it. There were some dodgy tackles by Sampdoria that weren't carded, but the 2 reds, imo, had good explanations.

 

[rfU]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

I think most Italian referees would have given that 2nd yellow, regardless of who committed it. There were some dodgy tackles by Sampdoria that weren't carded, but the 2 reds, imo, had good explanations.

fair enough, but check it out from reverse angle, i.e. from behind cordoba, before making up your mind. There was contact tho, but the second yellow was for the way Pozzi went flying. Again there was minimal contact:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7xSmffrk_c

I just not a fan of this dishing out 2nd yellows in the 1st half unless it absolutely certain. If anything it ruins a good game.

Here's something that bothered the hell out of me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyAv3KO3oRs

Right before Eto'o can send in a cross However, what was way more disappointing than the ref's severity towards us, was the behavior of our players. Acting very child like, it looked like WWE out there, not a professional sport. And then Mou with his giggling fits In someways it's necessary to get the referee to react in your favor, because if you don't, your opponents will. But this is an experienced lot, and I expect better. Very disappointing. No wonder Moratti issued a press silence. But again, we were fantastic in the 2nd half, Sampdoria did nothing worth worrying about, in fact they were closer to a goal before the sendings off. Looks like Mou's no-loss streak home streak since his Chelsea days will remain intact a while longer.

In other news, Udinese have rehired Marino Amazing with that team they haven't managed an away win all season.

 

[Ernestito]

Re: Serie A Thread - 2009/10 Season

f*cking cunt domenico celi, I hope you get bashed by a livorno fan sometime. how much did you get?